MAN LE180C double cab for a long family trip

[Jago]

Wow doppelganger!

Hi Itinerrant

I have just seen your post and your blog site (great site by the way!) and couldn't believe how similar your requirements, truck and designs are to ours! :Wow1:

We also have three small kids (girl of 3, boy 5 and a girl 6) and we plan to go travelling for a year or two next summer/autumn starting in South America (then possibly Europe/Asia Australia). We also hope to have our truck built by the summer (or preferably Easter) and do a mini expedition for a month (maybe Morocco?) before our big trip. We will also home school the kids and we are now looking to get our class C licence too! :smiley_drive:

We've also looked at MANs and several Actionmobil and Unicat designs (we even visited their factories -very impressive! But I think they are ultimately out of our price range even if the designs are good!).

We have very similar requirements and have also decided on a crew (or at least an extended) cab for the kids. We also realise that with 5 of us we will need space and have a design very similar to yours! (so it's reassuring our designs are virtually the same! -Hopefully we both have it right! :wings These layouts are 7.3m long but could easily be shortened down by 1 to 1.5m if required and then they would be very similar to yours!

See our favourite (option 2 below) with the shower in the passage way as well (wonder where that's from....)

[/url] Truck layout 1 7m Options 2 by Jago2007, on Flickr[/IMG]


We also thought of putting storage at the end of each bunk until the kids are bigger (but still want full size bunks so they don't out grow them or we can use them for adult friends if required or to re-sell). We have an alternative layout with double bunks (and one bed at 90 degrees to the lower bunk probably just below the cabin door) and the shower room in the entrance passage (not such a bad idea for hosing down mucky urchins! :snorkel

[/url] Truck layout 1 7m Options 1b by Jago2007, on Flickr[/IMG]

We have a U shaped lounge/table (that you climb over to reach the raised bed) to maximise seating area but I like your split lounge/table arrangement as this can be handy to have a separate table when preparing meals etc.

We went for the longer design as we thought we would need as much storage (and living) as possible, therefore to do a 7m+ design we would need a 6X6 instead of a 4X4 as although possible I think the extended wheelbase and overhang would be too long for a 4X4 when combined with an extended cab and definitely a crew cab?

Or have others seen this done OK?

Therefore we have been looking at 6x6 vehicles (you also get that 'Dakar' look :roost: !) but have found second hand 6X6 extended cab vehicles very rare!

We have found a site that can import used low mileage Tatras to the UK though! (http://www.russianmilitary.co.uk/for-sale.php?headers=land)

Since then we have been looking at these 6X6s even been considering an 8x8 Tatra T815!

[/url] Tatra Dakar Assistance Truck by Jago2007, on Flickr[/IMG]

Although this one looks lovely -it would do as it's brand new!

[/url] 815 8x8 New extended cab by Jago2007, on Flickr[/IMG]

So any advice would be helpful !
Is 8x8 too much?
Tatra - off road capable and endurable but comfortable and international enough?

Sorry Itinerrant - I don't want to hijack your thread (and for the long post!) but I would be interested in your views (or from anyone else) as you have considered similar things! I have emailed you separately if you want to discuss in more detail away from your build thread....

Good luck with the build and keep us informed! :lurk:
Cheers
Jago

 

[Victorian]

Very interested in following you build!

I live in a Victoria,BC Canada. A "must" see for many travelers doing the North to South America trip. One thing I always noticed, was the difficulty of finding parking and places to stop with such big trucks. Don't get me wrong, I love seeing these type of vehicles, after all I have helped building them for some time. But I think that overall size would be a HUGE consideration for me. An 8x8 may be amazing in the dessert and on some really rough roads in Russia. But I believe that most days you will hate have to deal with it.

On my travels, I have met families on around the worlds trips on bicycles, with family vans or "just" a 4x4 Unimog.

I guess, it all depends how you envision your trip to be. Not that there is anything wrong with it, but if you wish to have lots of living space, washing machine and big seating area, then you may go with an 8x8. Otherwise, I would really try to go as small as possible.

Got luck and please keep us posted!

Andreas

 

[Jago]

Andreas

You are right! - It's the constant compromise/trade off between space/storage/luxery and mobility/impact and accessibility!

This is the dilemma I struggle with the most - one minute I am thinking keep it as small as possible to be able to get into villages, towns and park.

The next minute I realise (once you've decided on a truck rather than 4wd & tents) we couldn't feasibly long term (1-2 years) with a family of 5 in anything less than a 5.6m cabin so the truck will be at least 7-9m overall (depending on truck crew cab or not).

Therefore does an extra metre or two make much difference if you are already that big? (as it would make a big difference internally- and possibly making it easier to long term in it?)

(Width and height are fairly costant and therefore not such a dilemma/consideration)

Help!
A nice dilemma to have anyway (and a great armchair problem as there's nver any right answer!) :coffeedrink:

 

[Victorian]

Unicat, Action Mobil and other have used "for sale" vehicles on their lot. Maybe they would be willing to let you stay in one of them for a couple of days (without going anywhere). I know of a couple of people that did that! That would be a low risk (and if your kids don't scratch anything:ylsmoke fairly cheap experiment!

 

[Lynn]

...This is the dilemma I struggle with the most - one minute I am thinking keep it as small as possible to be able to get into villages, towns and park.

The next minute I realise (once you've decided on a truck rather than 4wd & tents) we couldn't feasibly long term (1-2 years) with a family of 5 in anything less than a 5.6m cabin so the truck will be at least 7-9m overall (depending on truck crew cab or not).

I'm no expert, but I plan on copying something I saw on a build thread (sorry, not on this forum, and I didn't save the link, so can't give credit).

Anyway, the folks couldn't get the 'feel' of it from looking at 3D drawings, so they mocked up the entire cabin in their garage using cardboard and stuff. Then they spent lots of time pretending.

Seemed like a good idea to me.

Actually, I think someone on this forum did something similar with styrofoam, maybe?

 

[Kohburn]

I actually really like the idea of the doors to block off the toilet area turning the shower into a "mud room" for entering the camper. would allow you to washdown and not track stuff into the rest of the camper right at entry.

 

[Victorian]

Tons of space in a 8x8....

http://www.unicat.net/de/pics/MXXL24AH-3.html

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J_z8ldynEgQ"]YouTube - unicat 8x8[/ame]

 

[Itinerrant]

Designs and ideas

Hello Jago,

I have just seen your post and your blog site (great site by the way!) and couldn't believe how similar your requirements, truck and designs are to ours! :Wow1:

Thank you for your message. Indeed we seem to have a lot of things in common ! Here are some thoughts about your designs and ideas (mostly explaining ours !).


1. The length

With a cell of 7.3 meters long and an extended / crew cab for the truck, you will end up with a total length of around 10 meters. That is huge. We went in the US in 2008 for a 1 month trip in the south-west national parks and we had a rental C30 (30 feet length) camper. It was nice because we stayed on paved roads, but it was too long and wouldn't allow us to ride on offroad tracks (of course it wasn't meant for that, but anyway). To be honest, it is not only the overall length that matters, but mostly the wheelbase, and then the turning radius. Many offroaders we met told us that the wheelbase should not exceed 4 meters in order to preserve offroad capabilities and maneuverability. Having plenty of length would of course be very nice, but once you are in narrow and sharp turning roads (like mountain passes) or in villages little streets, things might be turning difficult.

The first design I made for our truck (before we found one) was of 4.5 meters length (it was meant for a 3.5 to 4 meters wheelbase). Then I came across the truck we finally bought, which has a wheelbase of 4.5 meters and a cell of 5.2 meters, so I redesigned everything to match the new length (I could make it a bit longer but then I thought about bicycles or tyres that might hang at the rear, winches that would protrude, etc., and decided to keep it as it is). But I would not have bought the truck had the wheelbase been longer. And I was not looking for more than 4 wheels also. I think that the 6x6 and 8x8 models you are thinking about would be awesome in the desert... but then maybe only in the desert. Also think about
a) the tyres : each one is about 700€ for my truck, and I will have 2 spares ; with an 8x8, how many spares are you going to carry ???
b) the fuel consumption : currently I have around 16-17 liters / 100 km (on the road) ; I think you can at least double those figures for an 8x8...

I already drove a little bit with my own truck, which is far smaller than those, and find that I have to be careful about taking corners and narrow roads. I still have to get used to its size ; it will come with the experience ! Maybe you will make your own idea while getting your class C licence !


2. The make

We made a lot of search for the truck, and we almost bought a Steyr 12M18. After some thoughts, we ended up deciding we would go for a MAN (or maybe a Mercedes). Why ? Because these makes are well known here, they have quite an extended network of dealers around the world, they are reliable, spare parts should be easy to find / buy.

Tatra's, Kamaz, etc. shure are fantastic trucks, but I don't know them. Who is going to service them here and while traveling ? How would I get spare parts for them ? Who am I going to call if something goes wrong ? (and in what language ?) Besides, if you look at Unicat, ActionMobil, etc., you see that most of their cells are built on MANs. I don't have their experience and I think they know what they are doing, so... I'm taking example


3. The dinettes

We already traveled with U-shaped dinettes and separate dinettes. We find ourselves much preferring the latter. This design allows us to set the children at the big table, and my wife and I at the small one ; the total table space is bigger so you have place for all the plates and dishes. It is easier for school teaching and (as you stated) for preparing meals. It also allows to lower only one table and still have the other left.

In our design, we put the dinettes at the rear, so that we have a large bench (stretching to the whole width of the cell) that can serve as a sofa (with panoramic view thanks to the three windows) or as an additional permanent bed. And with an extension joining the two tables, you can easily accomodate up to 7-8 persons, which would be quite difficult with a U-shaped dinette (not for the seats, but for the table space).


4. The kitchen

I don't really know if this sounds realistic / reasonable, but I feel more secure having the kitchen near the main entrance door. I think we will almost always cook with this door open, so if something goes wrong (a pan that bursts into flames or whatever), you just throw it outside. OK, it might seem a little bit ridiculous, but anyway. The other advantage I can see is that we can have a little folding table in the entrance that can serve as an extension to the kitchen's countertop.


5. The bathroom

We wanted to be able to use the shower and the toilet/sink spaces independently (I think it really matters when there are 5 persons in there !), hence the sliding doors. We first thought, as you did, to put the shower in the main entrance. But we then thought that it would be better to put it in the passage towards the truck's cabin, because :

a) this passage would be less used than the main entrance (at least at shower time !),
b) when someone is in the shower, it would be easier for someone else to go inside / outside the cell through the main entrance than through the truck's cabin passage.

There are also the points I mentioned here above about the kitchen.

We don't totally miss the point you mention about mud in the entrance and wet clothes, etc. because, thanks again to the sliding doors, we can throw everyting in the bathroom when climbing aboard the truck as it is just near the entrance. We even have space for the shoes just under the bathroom entrance step !


Your designs and views are great and I am really happy that you share them with us. I think that hard-thinking and discussing those designs and ideas will only lead us to better solutions, so this is why I explained my views here above.


Hope to see you some day on the road ! :coffeedrink:

 

[Jago]

Hi Itinerrant

Thanks for your reply and info! Like you said it's great to share views, designs and ideas so thanks..

I responded in blue to your info below

Hello Jago,


Thank you for your message. Indeed we seem to have a lot of things in common ! Here are some thoughts about your designs and ideas (mostly explaining ours !).


1. The length

With a cell of 7.3 meters long and an extended / crew cab for the truck, you will end up with a total length of around 10 meters. That is huge. We went in the US in 2008 for a 1 month trip in the south-west national parks and we had a rental C30 (30 feet length) camper. It was nice because we stayed on paved roads, but it was too long and wouldn't allow us to ride on offroad tracks (of course it wasn't meant for that, but anyway).

Yes this can be tricky:elkgrin:
We hired a 6 birth road camper (not sure how long but it must have been at least 27ft/8m) and it was a handful.

To be honest, it is not only the overall length that matters, but mostly the wheelbase, and then the turning radius. Many offroaders we met told us that the wheelbase should not exceed 4 meters in order to preserve offroad capabilities and maneuverability.
Yes I think this is true for 4X4 but I thought 6X6 and 8X8 avoid this as the wheelbases are short between the axles (ramp break over, entry and exit angles)

Having plenty of length would of course be very nice, but once you are in narrow and sharp turning roads (like mountain passes) or in villages little streets, things might be turning difficult.
This is true and the biggest problem I can see - especially in South America?

The first design I made for our truck (before we found one) was of 4.5 meters length (it was meant for a 3.5 to 4 meters wheelbase). Then I came across the truck we finally bought, which has a wheelbase of 4.5 meters and a cell of 5.2 meters, so I redesigned everything to match the new length (I could make it a bit longer but then I thought about bicycles or tyres that might hang at the rear, winches that would protrude, etc., and decided to keep it as it is). But I would not have bought the truck had the wheelbase been longer. And I was not looking for more than 4 wheels also. I think that the 6x6 and 8x8 models you are thinking about would be awesome in the desert... but then maybe only in the desert. Also think about
a) the tyres : each one is about 700€ for my truck, and I will have 2 spares ; with an 8x8, how many spares are you going to carry ???
Good point - probably could carry two and wouldn't like to think about the cost :Wow1:
b) the fuel consumption : currently I have around 16-17 liters / 100 km (on the road) ; I think you can at least double those figures for an 8x8...
I guess so (Tatra dealer thinks 8X8 is 10-20% more than 6X6 which is probably 20% more than 4X4?). I don't know if capacity would be too much of an issue as payload is much higher (although perversely not a lot of space under chassis!)

I already drove a little bit with my own truck, which is far smaller than those, and find that I have to be careful about taking corners and narrow roads. I still have to get used to its size ; it will come with the experience ! Maybe you will make your own idea while getting your class C licence !
True but I am eager to get one almost before my licence! :smiley_drive:


2. The make

We made a lot of search for the truck, and we almost bought a Steyr 12M18. After some thoughts, we ended up deciding we would go for a MAN (or maybe a Mercedes). Why ? Because these makes are well known here, they have quite an extended network of dealers around the world, they are reliable, spare parts should be easy to find / buy.
I agree - MANs were my first choice for the same reasons.
I started looking at Tatras for a crew cab 6X6 (I also thought they would be cheaper but now I'm not so sure...)

Tatra's, Kamaz, etc. shure are fantastic trucks, but I don't know them. Who is going to service them here and while traveling ? How would I get spare parts for them ? Who am I going to call if something goes wrong ? (and in what language ?)
Good point - I think parts are widely available but like you say they are not as well known.

Besides, if you look at Unicat, ActionMobil, etc., you see that most of their cells are built on MANs. I don't have their experience and I think they know what they are doing, so... I'm taking example

They are good example to take! When visiting Actionmobil and Unicat they seemed to use MAN (over say Mercedes) because as well as being very capable etc they were the most flexible/accommodating manufacturer for small scale specialist vehicles. Both Unicat and Actionmobile (outputing only about 5-7 vehicles each per year) are small scale to Mercedes).


3. The dinettes

We already traveled with U-shaped dinettes and separate dinettes. We find ourselves much preferring the latter. This design allows us to set the children at the big table, and my wife and I at the small one ; the total table space is bigger so you have place for all the plates and dishes. It is easier for school teaching and (as you stated) for preparing meals. It also allows to lower only one table and still have the other left.
Yes I like the flexibility there.

In our design, we put the dinettes at the rear, so that we have a large bench (stretching to the whole width of the cell) that can serve as a sofa (with panoramic view thanks to the three windows) or as an additional permanent bed. And with an extension joining the two tables, you can easily accomodate up to 7-8 persons, which would be quite difficult with a U-shaped dinette (not for the seats, but for the table space).
That's a good idea to combine when required for larger parties! :sombrero:

4. The kitchen

I don't really know if this sounds realistic / reasonable, but I feel more secure having the kitchen near the main entrance door. I think we will almost always cook with this door open, so if something goes wrong (a pan that bursts into flames or whatever), you just throw it outside. OK, it might seem a little bit ridiculous, but anyway. The other advantage I can see is that we can have a little folding table in the entrance that can serve as an extension to the kitchen's countertop.
For the above dinner parties maybe! :chef:


5. The bathroom

We wanted to be able to use the shower and the toilet/sink spaces independently (I think it really matters when there are 5 persons in there !),
Especially with 4 females eh!
hence the sliding doors. We first thought, as you did, to put the shower in the main entrance. But we then thought that it would be better to put it in the passage towards the truck's cabin, because :

a) this passage would be less used than the main entrance (at least at shower time !),
b) when someone is in the shower, it would be easier for someone else to go inside / outside the cell through the main entrance than through the truck's cabin passage.

There are also the points I mentioned here above about the kitchen.

We don't totally miss the point you mention about mud in the entrance and wet clothes, etc. because, thanks again to the sliding doors, we can throw everyting in the bathroom when climbing aboard the truck as it is just near the entrance. We even have space for the shoes just under the bathroom entrance step !

Yes I think we agree (as we prefer the design with the shower in the cab passage for the similar reasons). Although I take your point about sliding doors allowing separate use - could be good.


Your designs and views are great and I am really happy that you share them with us. I think that hard-thinking and discussing those designs and ideas will only lead us to better solutions, so this is why I explained my views here above.

Likewise and thanks for sharing. - Looks like I may need to reconsider some areas!


Hope to see you some day on the road ! :coffeedrink:

That would be great! - let me know if you come to London for any reason and I'll do the same when passing Belgium!:friday:
PS - did you get my email? If so you have my email address to get in touch.

 

[tamangel]

Space utilization..

Everyone here is aware of Rob Gray's site and his WORT's.. Might want to re-read both truck build threads as he later downsized from 10.5 meters (34') to 8.1 meters (26') citing better maneuverability and access to more locations.. Excellent thought behind space utilization..

Wothahellizat Mk1
http://www.robgray.com/graynomad/wothahellizat/wot1/index.php

Wothahellizat Mk2
http://www.robgray.com/graynomad/wothahellizat/wot2/index.php

Mike W

another good source:

Travel Vans by John Speed
Mercedes Van 814 4X4 6.3 meters (20.75')
see post 73 on this expo thread:
http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=42804&page=8

http://www.travelvans.co.uk/

 

[GlobalMonkey]

Tatra

Hi Itinerrant

I have just seen your post and your blog site (great site by the way!) and couldn't believe how similar your requirements, truck and designs are to ours! :Wow1:

We also have three small kids (girl of 3, boy 5 and a girl 6) and we plan to go travelling for a year or two next summer/autumn starting in South America (then possibly Europe/Asia Australia). We also hope to have our truck built by the summer (or preferably Easter) and do a mini expedition for a month (maybe Morocco?) before our big trip. We will also home school the kids and we are now looking to get our class C licence too! :smiley_drive:

We've also looked at MANs and several Actionmobil and Unicat designs (we even visited their factories -very impressive! But I think they are ultimately out of our price range even if the designs are good!).

We have very similar requirements and have also decided on a crew (or at least an extended) cab for the kids. We also realise that with 5 of us we will need space and have a design very similar to yours! (so it's reassuring our designs are virtually the same! -Hopefully we both have it right! :wings These layouts are 7.3m long but could easily be shortened down by 1 to 1.5m if required and then they would be very similar to yours!

See our favourite (option 2 below) with the shower in the passage way as well (wonder where that's from....)

[/url] Truck layout 1 7m Options 2 by Jago2007, on Flickr[/IMG]


We also thought of putting storage at the end of each bunk until the kids are bigger (but still want full size bunks so they don't out grow them or we can use them for adult friends if required or to re-sell). We have an alternative layout with double bunks (and one bed at 90 degrees to the lower bunk probably just below the cabin door) and the shower room in the entrance passage (not such a bad idea for hosing down mucky urchins! :snorkel

[/url] Truck layout 1 7m Options 1b by Jago2007, on Flickr[/IMG]

We have a U shaped lounge/table (that you climb over to reach the raised bed) to maximise seating area but I like your split lounge/table arrangement as this can be handy to have a separate table when preparing meals etc.

We went for the longer design as we thought we would need as much storage (and living) as possible, therefore to do a 7m+ design we would need a 6X6 instead of a 4X4 as although possible I think the extended wheelbase and overhang would be too long for a 4X4 when combined with an extended cab and definitely a crew cab?

Or have others seen this done OK?

Therefore we have been looking at 6x6 vehicles (you also get that 'Dakar' look :roost: !) but have found second hand 6X6 extended cab vehicles very rare!

We have found a site that can import used low mileage Tatras to the UK though! (http://www.russianmilitary.co.uk/for-sale.php?headers=land)

Since then we have been looking at these 6X6s even been considering an 8x8 Tatra T815!

[/url] Tatra Dakar Assistance Truck by Jago2007, on Flickr[/IMG]

Although this one looks lovely -it would do as it's brand new!

[/url] 815 8x8 New extended cab by Jago2007, on Flickr[/IMG]

So any advice would be helpful !
Is 8x8 too much?
Tatra - off road capable and endurable but comfortable and international enough?

Sorry Itinerrant - I don't want to hijack your thread (and for the long post!) but I would be interested in your views (or from anyone else) as you have considered similar things! I have emailed you separately if you want to discuss in more detail away from your build thread....

Good luck with the build and keep us informed! :lurk:
Cheers
Jago

Hi Jago,
go with Tatra 6x6 crew cab, the only way to go with three children. I do not want to steal this this thread, so I will send you a PM with more info.
Good luck, Tomas

 

[Itinerrant]

The only way ???

Hello,

go with Tatra 6x6 crew cab, the only way to go with three children.

That is certainly not the only way to go. Please have a look at these (in French, sorry, but anyway) :

• aquandes.be (3 children in a double cab old Magirus-Deutz truck with a camper cell)
• www.opensens.com (3 children in a Unimog)
• www.14pattes.com (3 children and a dog in a camper)
• lebourgdumonde.typepad.fr (3 children in a 4x4 van and a caravan)
• www.sixencar.com (4 children in a bus)
• deliryautourdumonde.blogspot.com (7 (!) children in camper / boat)
• www.clu7.fr (5 children in a boat)
• www.petitsmousses.fr (5 children in a boat)

But as you stated, it is not the point of this thread (well in fact, yes, it is a little bit, as I have 3 children and I will not drive a 6x6 Tatra ).

@Jago : I will reply to your post ASAP.

 

[GlobalMonkey]

choice

Hello,

That is certainly not the only way to go. Please have a look at these (in French, sorry, but anyway) :

• aquandes.be (3 children in a double cab old Magirus-Deutz truck with a camper cell)
• www.opensens.com (3 children in a Unimog)
• www.14pattes.com (3 children and a dog in a camper)
• lebourgdumonde.typepad.fr (3 children in a 4x4 van and a caravan)
• www.sixencar.com (4 children in a bus)
• deliryautourdumonde.blogspot.com (7 (!) children in camper / boat)
• www.clu7.fr (5 children in a boat)
• www.petitsmousses.fr (5 children in a boat)

But as you stated, it is not the point of this thread (well in fact, yes, it is a little bit, as I have 3 children and I will not drive a 6x6 Tatra ).

@Jago : I will reply to your post ASAP.

Hi Itinerrant,
you are absolutely correct. My comment was directed to Jago, who has already decided on Tatra and was trying to make decission between Crew Cab and Extended Cab and between 6x6 and 8x8.
I personally know that anyone can travel with a very little.
I have traveled the entire Europe in Citroen 2CV.
I have traveled North America in an old Chevrolet Impala Station wagon.
Now we travel with my girlfriend all over North America on a motorcycle.


So again you are correct, but from the choices Jago mentioned, I would go with Tatra 6x6 Crew Cab. I would go with Tatra before I take MAN or Mercedes. But again, it is a personal choice.

I am watching your build Itinerrant, I think you have a great design.
Be safe, Tomas

 

[Itinerrant]

Some more thoughts

Hello Jago,

Yes I think this is true for 4X4 but I thought 6X6 and 8X8 avoid this as the wheelbases are short between the axles (ramp break over, entry and exit angles)

Your are right about entry / exit angles that are better the more wheels you have (also passing trenches up to 2 meters !), but I saw that the turning circle of some Tatra models could be up to 30 meters ! That would certainly be undriveable in most (at least a little civilized) places

I guess so (Tatra dealer thinks 8X8 is 10-20% more than 6X6 which is probably 20% more than 4X4?).

There's also another related point : the top-speed. I know this would not be that much of an issue when you're into the wild because there will not be many places where you will drive above 80 km/h or even 60 km/h. But I think that both of us have a *long* way to go before reaching those places (for me e.g. it counts in thousands of kilometers to reach Africa), and this means... highway. I don't know the top speed of the Tatra's ; with my truck (which is not very powerful : only 180HP), I can easily reach 100-110 km/h.

True but I am eager to get one almost before my licence!

Did you get it ?

I agree - MANs were my first choice for the same reasons.
I started looking at Tatras for a crew cab 6X6 (I also thought they would be cheaper but now I'm not so sure...)

Please take a look at this blog (texts in English also). The guy bought a new truck stating that given the current crisis, truck makers have dramatically reduced their selling prices, so they can compare with used trucks prices. Maybe you could get a good deal ?

Yes I think we agree (as we prefer the design with the shower in the cab passage for the similar reasons). Although I take your point about sliding doors allowing separate use - could be good.

About the shower, I think there are some more reasons to place it in the walk-through passage to the driver's cabin instead of in the main cell entrance :

• when someone showers, door and walls and floor will be wet : I think that will be more annoying in the main entrance;
• in the walk-through passage, it will be easier to install a double floor into which a waste water tank for the shower can be put, and it will be freeze-proof ; that would be more difficult in the main entrance of the cell ;
• if the shower is in the main entrance of the cell, then the main entrance cannot be used for anything else (switches, control panels, shoes and coats storages, fire extinguisher, torch lamp, folding table for kitchen countertop extension, etc.).

Your designs and views are great and I am really happy that you share them with us.

Thank you
That said, I see (at least) 2 main flaws in my design :

1. the over-the-dinettes bed could be fault (breakdowns)-prone and will have to be carefully built to be solid and handy at the same time,
2. the storage opening and the window in the rear wall will make it more difficult to carry something at the rear (like bicycles, spare wheels or a bike) ; regarding to this, your design with the bed at the rear is better (but then it would be too long for me) ; this is why the rear window will not be openable ; there will be a 70cm height space between the bottom of the rear window and the storage opening where maybe I can put something like a bicycle carrier.

Looks like I may need to reconsider some areas!

Better now than too late !

PS - did you get my email? If so you have my email address to get in touch.

Yes I got it, thank you. But I thought that answering here could perhaps benefit to some people interested in our discussion. Once I get the time, I will post detailed views of the different elements of the cell. In the meantime, please feel free to keep posting about your thoughts and designs or mine here.

 

[Jago]

Update on my truck choice!

Hi Itinerrant

Sorry I've been away from the thread - too busy checking out trucks to buy! :wings:

I think your advice is great and will be looking at a few point so to change on mine (e.g. your reasoning behind the shower placement is good!)

And thanks for the links- always interesting to to check out how other families are doing it!

As for the truck choice - I hadn't really decided on Tatra before posting previously. But Globalmonkey (Tomas) has been great! helping me source trucks and specs etc in Czech (I can highly recommend his help if anyone else is thinking of Tatra!).

In the interests if comfort and long term living we have decided to go bigger rather than smaller - so a 7.5m cabin and a crew cab - probably about 10m overall (tbd!). As previously discussed, it's a trade off with accessability but our preferred compromise (and I'll still try and squeeze the truck down tight roads! :sombrero

I have ruled out an 8x8 as it's just not as practical and would be more costly and thirsty on the road etc. (Like you - I also thought the turning circle might require using the high payload of the vehicle - to carry your own turntable so you can put it down at the corner of each mountain road bend! :elkgrin

Therefore we are now after a 6X6 crew cab (possibly with a wheelbase extension for our cabin). Tatras are definitely an option, the commercial ones are fast enough, (I also saw this as a requirement for European motorways), tough enough and cheap enough - you can get a them from 15k euros upwards (ex-military non Euro compliant are cheapest, you need to add another 15-20k euros for commercial Euro 2 or 3 compliant models) and overhaul them, change cabs, chassis length etc for another 10-15k euros. So you can come out with a very good truck to your specs for 35-55k euros depending on spec and how recent the thetruck and Euro compliance needs to be. (Euro 3 is good in London until 2012 (after that it's £200 per day for non compliant vehicles :Wow1 but by then we'll be gone!)

We are going out to Czech look at Tatras in the first week of Jan but I will check out the links and you gave about the new (cheap) MANs as I want to consider all alternatives and they are definately one of the best vehicles for overlanding for the reasons of support and back up etc that you mention.

But it's all very exciting stuff and about to happen one way or the other :victory:

And let's not forget - (as interesting as it is and as techie as we all get over specs) - The end result that the trucks enable us to do - travel, experience new adventures, people and places!

Anyway - less about my decisions - let's hear more about your truck - how's the build coming? What's your timescales?

I all going well (and presuming I pass my licence :bike_rider I should be bringing a truck back to the UK at the end of Jan/Start of Feb - I'd love to pop in and see your progress or meet up for a drink!

Looking forward to future posts to see your build progress
Cheers
Jago