MAN LE180C double cab for a long family trip

[Itinerrant]

Just to celebrate 10,000 views on the thread...

Hello all,

A little update.

Nice, one step closer!

Yes, indeed. We're getting really impatient now !

are you going to streach the frame at all, or just keep it the way it is? (I do not recall if you mentioned that, sorry)

No, we will keep it as it is : 4.5 meters wheelbase. This allows us to put a 5.2 meters box on the rear (sufficient for the 5 of us), while keeping a rather goog maneuverability.

are you going to keep the yellow lights and the reflective stickers?

Well the stickers that are on the actual box will go away with it as we will have an entirely new one. I haven't decided anything about the lights and the stickers that are on the truck cabin. The lights will probably go away if we decide to put some storage (maybe the spare wheels) on the roof. But I keep them for now because our children like them very much ! :bike_rider:

Félicitations pour tes avancées.

Merci !

If you ever have to circulate in a dock yard (RORO for international travel for instance) they’re mandatory if you don’t want to pay the price of an escort.

Well I never heard of that but it's a good reason to keep them, thank you ! Or maybe think about a system like the police : be able to put them on and off the roof with one hand, maybe with some kind of magnetic fixation ! :victory:

The stealth aspect is two fold

About this, we want to be as discrete as possible, but not going to the point where we would have to hide.

Security wise I remain undecided about the windows. Seitz is easy, cheapish and light, KTC is expensive, heavy and difficult, but indestructible.

I've also heard of a company named ParaPress, based in Luxembourg (Europe), which seems to build good windows at a reasonable price. Anyone experienced with them ?

Glad to hear your trucks off for the build stage - how exciting! :luxhello:

I could not say more !

Our Tatra is being refurbed in Czech now and should be ready to collect on the w/c 7th of March to bring back to the UK for our cabin build.

Any news / pictures ?

We went for a different configuration in the end - instead of a Doka/crew cab which are huge on the Tatras (@ 3m I think they are bigger than the MAN crew cabs?)

Yes, probably.

we have gone for an extended/sleeper cab, to fit the kids seats behind in the second row. So as well as changing the cab they are refurbing and servicing as necessary and lengthening the chassis to 4.5m

Excellent length ! Just the same as ours

If we can bring it back and start the build in March I think we should have it ready for June!

Good luck !

I am leaning towards electric for cooking now as well [...] - as long as you get your electrical requirements properly specced for the size of your batteries, inverters and generators etc beforehand I think this is a safe option.

As far as we are concerned, we will have :

• 4 x 220 Ah batteries
• 2 x 80 W solar panels (can be extended later)
• 1 x Telair 4004D Hatz diesel generator (4 kW)

The main electricity consumers will be :

• the fridge (Waeco HDC 190, ca. 75 W)
• the induction cooking table (I found one at Ikea that draws only 2300 W)
• the micro-wave oven (ca. 1000 W)

Well, that's it for now. The builder and I came upon an agreement so the build is ready to start. Can't wait for the first visit, due to the end of april. Of course, I will keep you posted ! :wavey:

 

[charlieaarons]

If you have only 160 w of solar and use electric cooking,
you will run out of battery power constantly and
need the use of a generator. Preferably diesel gen.
I'd recommend gas for cooking.

Charlie

 

[Ford Prefect]

If you have only 160 w of solar and use electric cooking,
you will run out of battery power constantly and
need the use of a generator. Preferably diesel gen.
I'd recommend gas for cooking.

Charlie

Hey Charlie,

Just for my personal education, how much would you recommend he have in solar if he were to continue with the electric cooker?

Thanks

 

[LukeH]

I’ll try to do this and the experts can correct me; I’m a mechanical engineer, not electrical:
Assuming that the cooker is the only load that you have on the batteries (false assumption)
Assuming that one does one hour of cooking per day, with an average draw of 1 kw (1 ring for an hour or two for ½ etc.), and assuming the inverter is 90% efficient the current drawn off the 24V battery bank is 46.3 amps for an hour, or 46.3AH (as an aside that’s 10.5% of Itinerrant’s battery capacity so as long as it’s put back each day he won’t ruin the batteries prematurely)
So to break even on a long stay your solar has to put that back in each day.
Assuming that you get 6 hours of usable sunshine per day the panels have to supply 46.3/6 = 7.7 amps for that period.
A 24v panel system must therefore be 7.7x24 = 185 watts. THEORETICAL In reality if you buy a 200w panel specifically for this it won’t do the job.
Sudden zwiiip back to reality…..
To get 200w out of a 200w panel it has to be perfectly pointed at the sun, on a “test conditions” day, and perfectly clean. The voltage out of the panel at that moment is too much for your batteries, so a regulator is necessary, creating a loss.
Generally on the top of our trucks the panels are horizontal, a bit dusty, maybe a leaf or two on them and we might even have parked near a tree. IMHO you’re not even going to get half of the rated power during the 6 hours that the sun is high enough to fall on your panels.
All that is without taking into account the other uses; lighting, heating/cooling, water pumps etc.etc.
That generator will be disturbing the peace more than I personally would like (please notice this is my opinion, not an absolute judgement on other people’s generator use choice).

I would look at getting at least four times the calculated panel power, just to break even, and think strongly about economic cooking methods/equipment.

On a previous truck my 2 x 80W x 12volt panels only just kept my Waeco CF80 cool without killing the 180AH battery bank.

These considerations are also subject to intended use too; if you tour, you can simply go for a huge battery bank and a high output (or multiple) alternator(s). You’re going to start the engine each day so even the genny might not be necessary. If you like to do a Rob Gray, and watch nature in the middle of nowhere for months on end, then starting an engine of any sort is undesirable, and solar becomes interesting.
I’m still hoping to be able to build a genny free truck, but it’s not going to be easy as I’m going to have some big consumers: washing machine, dishwasher and Aircon.
The roof I have available will be able to tilt (one day), and can accommodate up to 1000 watts of 24v panels, and I’m kind of counting on completely covering it (and maybe the cab roof too)! The thread on battery powered aircon sunk without trace, when one day I get to that stage I’ll revive it and share what I’ve found.
If I look at the prices on Ali BaBa, covering the roof with PV cells is going to cost less than a silent remote start RV or yacht generator.

Now to find those combined PV panels that have a water circuit underneath for my hot water. Saw them once on the net and never found them again.

 

[NeverEnough]

If I look at the prices on Ali BaBa, covering the roof with PV cells is going to cost less than a silent remote start RV or yacht generator.

It is true that you can get decent panels for US$1.85/watt these days (cheaper if you buy a whole pallet of 20-30 units). But a 500-1000 watt array requires some pricey infrastructure: charge controllers, battery bank, inverter/charger, disconnects, distribution panel, combiners, etc. With all that taken into account, I spent close to US$7/watt for each array (600W and 1200W). It's possible to do it for less cheaper components, but still more expensive than most generators. My generator weighs 180 lbs, and I hope to use it as little as possible, but I wouldn't go without it, just for redundancy's sake.

Itinerrant, I completely agree with LukeH about upsizing your panel configuration if possible. An 2000W appliance will take your batteries down to the 40% mark pretty quickly. Of course, you can always charge with the truck or the genset, but you'll need a bigger array if you want to keep that bank charged for running a cooktop, A/C unit, or any other large load.

As for an induction cooktop, my experience with doing a lot of caravan cooking over the years is a solid preference for gas. It would be even more important if I were to live in the rig full-time. Quality of cooking means quality of living for a lot of us, and I prefer gas ranges at home and on the road. Carrying LPG let's us cook outside with a portable grill in addition to providing for inside cooking.

I'm also a big believer in redundancy for mission -critical systems, and cooking is mission-critical to my family. We have always carried a portable induction cooktop in our caravans that can be powered from the generator if needed. And having LPG on-board provides additional redundancy for refrigeration and hot water.

But mainly, it's just better to cook with! As always, I must confess that I've never left North America in a caravan, and I've never tried to fill an LPG bottle in Africa.

 

[Itinerrant]

First visit

Hello,

Thanks for all the replies and comments.

Well obviously it seems that I didn't make myself clear about our electricity system. I *know* that the 2 x 80 W solar panels won't be enough and I mentioned that they will be extended later. Besides, I also mentioned that we *will* have a generator, and I think I don't mind at all starting it for 1/2h cooking per day if needed. We'll see.

As for redundancy, I think we will do it the other way : using induction for everyday and have a small gas burner in case of emergency. As a last resort, it's always possible to make a fire.
And if all this doesn't work, I guess it won't be too difficult to convert our installation back to gas. We will have one year to test it all.

Some news now. Last WE I went to see the truck for the first time since the beginning of the work. Things didn't change that much (most of the pieces and components have been ordered but have not arrived yet) but I wanted to see the truck and discuss some details with the builder.

​

The rear box is now gone and the chassis is naked. A bit more rust than I expected, but nothing dramatic. One of the chassis beam (the right one) is a bit twisted, about 1/2 to 1 cm at the rear, but the subframe will handle that. The truck cabin has been cut to allow for the pass-through. The cut seems clean and neat. The surrounding metallic frame has been placed ; the gaps from the previous window will be filled soon and everything will be painted.

Building credits : Taveirne mobil
​

As usual, more pictures and details on our blog. That's it for now, next visit is planned at the end of may. :wavey:

 

[Ford Prefect]

Thanks for the updates!

Looks like it is coming right along!

Is there a link to your blog written in English?

Why, if I may, did you decide to make the pass through so narrow? I think that I may have been tempted to make it the width of the window. Is there something in the camper portion that would limit that possibility?

Thanks,

Brian

(sigh, still so jealous, wish I could get a MAN truck here...)

 

[DzlToy]

could I trouble you for some dimensions?

Length, width and height on just the cab portion of the truck (without lights, bumpers, steps, etc) and then length, width and height overall as the truck sits right now?

Thanks in advance.

 

[Itinerrant]

Answers

Hello,

Is there a link to your blog written in English?

Sorry, our blog is in French only. However, you can get a more or less accurate translation using Google. Here is the link to the translated page, not that bad. You can still navigate through the site, Google will handle the translation for you on the fly. Wonderful Maybe I'll think to put a translation button directly on the site one day.

Why, if I may, did you decide to make the pass through so narrow? I think that I may have been tempted to make it the width of the window. Is there something in the camper portion that would limit that possibility?

Yes. From the camper side, the pass-through width cannot exceed the one of the shower. From the truck side, the height cannot exceed the one of the cabin (of course) and we wanted to preserve the four seats of the bench, so the vehicle itself decided the dimensions of the pass-through !

could I trouble you for some dimensions? Length, width and height on just the cab portion of the truck (without lights, bumpers, steps, etc) and then length, width and height overall as the truck sits right now?

The inhabitable part of the vehicle is (outer) 5220 mm long, 2400 mm height and 2420 mm wide. Walls and ceiling are 50 mm thick, floor 90 mm. So inner dimensions are 5120 mm long, 2260 mm height and 2320 mm wide.

Overall truck dimensions I don't know exactly yet. The truck cabin is about 2.9 meters high and 2.4 meters wide. With the previous box the truck had on it, the overall height was about 3.3 meters and length was about 8 meters. I don't expect the length to change much with the new cell, but the height will be extended to about 3.7 meters I think.

Next post will be about the second visit (coming soon !) :wavey:

 

[DzlToy]

Thanks for the measurements!

I did not see two of the cab dimensions, they are illustrated below.

Cheers

 

[Itinerrant]

Second visit

Hello,

We went to see the truck for the second time since the beginning of the build on May, 28th.

​

Surprise, the GRP panels have arrived and have been mounted :wings: (they are glued and not screwed-glued as I first thought) ! All the cuts have been made for the openings. So we now have a good first idea of our future living space. :Wow1:

​

On the rear, the trunk door already has its metallic frame and three solid hinges.

​

Inside, aluminium corners have been placed to strengthen the structure. They are larger at the rear because they will support the mobile bed.

​

Under, we can see the metallic subframe.

​

And, on the truck chassis, there are the subframe fixation points : 2 fixed points at the rear, and 6 mobile points towards the front (thus 1 fixed point and 3 mobile points on each side of the truck). The yellow springs for the mobile points allow a 6 cm travel, beginning to move at a 300 kg charge.

​

The generator also arrived.

Building credits : Taveirne mobil
​

Things are starting to move and we are really excited ! More pictures here (english translation).

Next visit : end of June. :wavey:

 

[Itinerrant]

Measures

Hello,

I did not see two of the cab dimensions, they are illustrated below.

H : ca. 250 cm
V : ca. 165 cm (+ 125 cm from the ground, so a total of ca. 290 cm)

 

[Itinerrant]

Third visit

Hello

We went for the third visit last Saturday, a bit unexpected but it was on our way to some holiday at the Belgian coast, so we couldn't resist to show the progress to the kids.

So what's new ?

• Some outer corners

​

• Metal frame and hinges for the front door

​

• Some eletrical wires

​

• Mobile bed support

​

• Waste water tanks (toilet 120 liters, grey waters 160 liters)

​

• Fresh water tanks (2 x 215 liters) have arrived !

Building credits : Taveirne mobil
​

Hope to hear from you soon ! :wavey:

 

[Itinerrant]

Fourth visit

Hello

Some news.

• Corners have been painted

​

• Main entrance door

​

• Living area roof window

​

• Shower area roof window

​

• Mobile bed rails

​

• Under cabin rear storage

​

• Generator is in its place

Building credits : Taveirne mobil
​

 

[Overland Hadley]

:lurk: