more evidence that the Wrangler may be in for a change

[marktutone]

How much weight can you loose by going to an IFS system. I don't think you loose any weight. I think IFS is for handling and softer ride. Going to an IFS system would like putting a Honda engine in a Harley Davidson frame. Jeeps are like Coca Cola, Harley Davidson, and the Second Amendment. Solid front and rear axles will never go away.

 

[drcoopster]

How much weight can you loose by going to an IFS system. I don't think you loose any weight. I think IFS is for handling and softer ride.

Yes, you won't see any weight loss with IFS, but your unsprung weight will be dramatically less, resulting in much better suspension performance. Also, the driveline gets tucked up nice and tight, so you have more ground clearance (assuming all else stays roughly equal).

 

[MR.Ty]

I for one cannot wait for the next model to come out. Ill finally have the "newer" model of wrangler to hate on... and ill be accepted by my predecessors. Lol

 

[AndrewP]

I think a lot of this is a marketing strategy. Jeep buyers are very, very afraid of change and by saying that the new jeep wrangler is going to be on a dodge dart chassis makes people freak out and buy the model out currently. Wrangler sales go up every month and Chrysler has already moved the redesign date back as well because sales are so steady. Chrysler wants you to worry that the beloved Wrangler is going away, so you buy the one out now and all of the Mopar accessories to go with it. They did the same thing before the JK platform came out and they are doing it again.

Thank you for this. I am a very long time Toyota guy. But...I have this irrational "like" for the JK Unlimited Rubicon. I have rented one 3 times on Vacation for a couple of weeks each time, and it's a good machine. I was considering buying one because it's the last of the Mohicans. If this is all a ploy, I'll just wait.

 

[haven]

Car and Driver has an article about the same comment by Mike Manley. C/D is less concerned about the implications.

http://blog.caranddriver.com/next-j...rget-soft-suvs-but-it-wont-be-ruined-we-hope/

Today, Jeep IFS sales are double the sales of all Wranglers (170,000 Grand Cherokee and Cherokee vs 85,000 Wrangler, approximately).

 

[haven]

If we accept these six key attributes of Wrangler success:

-- low entry price
-- removable roof and doors
-- appeal to youthful customers
-- support by aftermarket accessory companies
-- "adventurous" image
-- actual off-road capability

I think Jeep could build a lighter weight, more economical new Wrangler with IFS and meet all six of these criteria. Jeep would need to hire folks like Scott Brady to show that the new model has off-road chops similar to the old SFA model, at least in stock form.

No doubt, the aftermarket companies that produce Ford 9 inch axles and V8 adapter kits for JKs would have to go back to the drawing board. But I think a large group of current Wrangler owners could be convinced to buy the new product.

Chrysler doesn't really manufacture the Wrangler. They build it from sub-assemblies provided by three independent suppliers with operations in the Toledo Supplier Park. Jeep could cut a deal with these companies to continue the production of the current JK for a couple of years, while the skeptics are won over.

 

[UK4X4]

What if IFS meant they were going to look at a real off-road design, and not some pressed tin off the shelf short arms...........from the soccer mum parts bin

I could see IFS catching on, in a wrangler if it had an offroad bias to its design, and its function was equivalent to the standard rubicon off the shelf, in flex and drop, with a built in 2" lift ability designed in from factory for adding some just larger than stock tires.....think of the percentage of JK's running anything over 32-35" OD tires.....

 

[Hilldweller]

If we accept these six key attributes of Wrangler success:
-- low entry price
-- removable roof and doors
-- appeal to youthful customers
-- support by aftermarket accessory companies
-- "adventurous" image
-- actual off-road capability
....

You left out one of the biggest keys to success.
The Jeep Wrangler is a big-boy's Leggo set. Easy to wrench. Easy to modify, especially the suspension.
After spending 3 times the time and energy to lift an Xterra a few months ago, jeez, not wanting an IFS in my future.

 

[marktutone]

If we accept these six key attributes of Wrangler success:

-- low entry price
-- removable roof and doors
-- appeal to youthful customers
-- support by aftermarket accessory companies
-- "adventurous" image
-- actual off-road capability

I think Jeep could build a lighter weight, more economical new Wrangler with IFS and meet all six of these criteria. Jeep would need to hire folks like Scott Brady to show that the new model has off-road chops similar to the old SFA model, at least in stock form.

No doubt, the aftermarket companies that produce Ford 9 inch axles and V8 adapter kits for JKs would have to go back to the drawing board. But I think a large group of current Wrangler owners could be convinced to buy the new product.

Chrysler doesn't really manufacture the Wrangler. They build it from sub-assemblies provided by three independent suppliers with operations in the Toledo Supplier Park. Jeep could cut a deal with these companies to continue the production of the current JK for a couple of years, while the skeptics are won over.

The seventh attribute. Solid Axle
One of the reasons I bought my Jeep was that it had solid front and rear axle.
People who really use their vehicles off road prefer solid axles. Just google Tacoma SAS, Frontier SAS, 4runner SAS. SAS is solid axle swap. I think it would be an extreme mistake if Jeep went to IFS.

 

[GetOutThere]

You left out one of the biggest keys to success.
The Jeep Wrangler is a big-boy's Leggo set. Easy to wrench. Easy to modify, especially the suspension.
After spending 3 times the time and energy to lift an Xterra a few months ago, jeez, not wanting an IFS in my future.

I agree completely.

In fact, the first 3 on Haven's list did not apply to me at all when buying my wrangler.

I bought my wrangler because it is the best off road worthy vehicle on the market, especially for the price. I can modify it as I see fit, easily, in my own drive way. Purists may hate me for it, but if I could have bought the wrangler with permanent roof and doors, I would have. That being said, if the wrangler had IFS at the time of my purchase, I would have bought something else. Probably a 4Runner Trail edition.

Now, I fully understand that I am in the minority of Jeep owners. 90% of the Jeep owners I meet absolutely love my Jeep, they love to look at the off roading kit it has, the pin striping, the mud, etc... but then they love to go back to their sahara, never change a thing, and never go further than a gravel road.

People like that worry me, because they're the one's that are keeping the brand alive. It's not people like us here on this forum. Those of us here are simply not a representative example of the majority of Jeep owners.

 

[haven]

"I could see IFS catching on, in a wrangler if it had an offroad bias to its design, and its function was equivalent to the standard rubicon"

I think Jeep could offer a long travel IFS with uprated shocks in the Rubicon package, while using a standard IFS for the less expensive models.

There's no reason why an IFS can't have excellent articulation. For example, the Raptor and the Wrangler Rubicon Unlimited have similar articulation, measured on a ramp, with swaybar connected. The Rubicon improves quite a bit with the swaybar disconnected.

 

[Hilldweller]

I think you have to look at what GetOutThere said.
And I, a Jeep guy, agree totally.
We put up with Jeep-isms largely for the solid front axle.
If Jeep had switched to IFS in 2014, there would be no Jeep in my driveway. I would've gone Toyota or Nissan.

 

[Justincredible]

I'm going to play devil's advocate here:

As long as it could still fit 33" tires with no modification, or 35" tires with flat fenders I probably still would have bought a Wrangler with IFS.

I love the look, the removable roof, and taking it off road, but I rarely see the need for the articulation disconnected solid axles provide except in rigs that are pretty built.
Out in the desert, heading up to most camping spots, and even through most of Moab a stock Wrangler with sway bars still connected will get you there. Throw in IFS and it will get you there with more speed and comfort.

 

[Christophe Noel]

In speaking with one of Jeep's executives he brought up a couple of valid observations. Firstly, they can't sell enough Wranglers to meet demand and anyone within the brand that would threaten that success by diluting the product would be a primo idiot. Secondly, the Jeep brand is largely defined by the Wrangler, so staying as true to its roots is of principle concern. The particulars of its make-up may evolve, but it has to stay as true to the original as possible. Thirdly, every new iteration of the Wrangler has been met with derision from the loyalists, but within a year or two is invariably lauded as the best ever.

As an example, the newest Cherokee was almost universally loathed on release as many felt it didn't measure up to its predecessor. That predecessor, loved as it is now, was equally loathed on its release.

Jeep has made very few missteps over the years. It would be hard to see them really pooching the next incarnation of their most celebrated model.

 

[Hilldweller]

....

Jeep has made very few missteps over the years. It would be hard to see them really pooching the next incarnation of their most celebrated model.

cough cough cough rectangular headlights cough cough....