New Defender Rage/Hate Thread

[Pilat]

I know it was overdue for an upgrade. That was my point. I also know it wasn't purchased by farmers for the last years - maybe even those fifteen years you mention. No one wanting the best farm tool would buy something like that when you have cheap pickups and whatnot much better than that and much cheaper.

 

[Colin Hughes]

Maybe Scott Brady can add a pissing contest to Overland Expo so those who want to can grab a beer and a chair and sit back and enjoy those wishing to go at it. Come on guys, two threads have already been locked down, this is just getting silly now. Oh, and by the way, I hate the new Defender simply because I can't afford it!

 

[Pilat]

Maybe Scott Brady can add a pissing contest to Overland Expo so those who want to can grab a beer and a chair and sit back and enjoy those wishing to go at it. Come on guys, two threads have already been locked down, this is just getting silly now. Oh, and by the way, I hate the new Defender simply because I can't afford it!

It's in a thread entitled "New Defender Rage/Hate Thread ".

 

[mpinco]

If you think about it this thread highlights the market segment that Jim Ratcliffe of Ineos Grandadier is targeting as LR moves upmarket with the Luxury Defender even as they (LR) grapple with poor reliability and high warranty cost that has to be eating their bottom line alive.

 

[EricTyrrell]

Maybe Scott Brady can add a pissing contest to Overland Expo so those who want to can grab a beer and a chair and sit back and enjoy those wishing to go at it. Come on guys, two threads have already been locked down, this is just getting silly now. Oh, and by the way, I hate the new Defender simply because I can't afford it!

This is a civil discussion so far. The thread is supposed to mock criticizers, but the product is so deserving of criticism that it invariably veers into actual criticism. If we can't debate the merits, or lack thereof, of relevant products then this forum is severely flawed.

 

[Blaise]

The product is so deserving of criticism...

Yet none of us can actually drive one to make any actual decisions. Carry on...

I think the iPhone 12 sucks.

 

[mpinco]

JLR needs to correct their QRA issues before they jump on the electrification bandwagon and release dozens of new models. If they don't it will bury them. Their warranty reputation and cost will force them to be even more of a urban only manufacturer.

 

[EricTyrrell]

The product is so deserving of criticism...

Yet none of us can actually drive one to make any actual decisions. Carry on...

I think the iPhone 12 sucks.

No one is criticizing how it drives, only what has been presented so far, which is extensive data and media. I'm sure it drives quite nice, just like their other comfy little cars. It's probably even more capable than any modern LR. It's a decent Discovery 5, much better than that bloated crossover thing of the same name, but it's no Defender. An F150 is more of a Defender than the new Defender. Strong steel frame, aluminum body, ZF trans, similar hood shape, V8 & diesel options, various cab configurations, at least one solid axle, a bed (for actual work), and most of all, used by the same industry and government markets that LR abandoned. Ford is finishing up the Bronco to meet utility station wagon needs at this moment.

 

[A.J.M]

Did LR abandon the market, or did the market abandon LR?

 

[blackangie]

You must have missed the post where I noted I have a LR4 w/HD. Virtually the same as the new Luxury Defender. While better than TC1 as sample rate has increased and algorithms updated, the operation remains the same. In essence it is reverse ABS TC with 2 locking diffs (rear and center). Much better than open diffs but not quite 3 lockers.

Actually its not the same at all, its vastly different, it now has brake by wire which activates the brakes/TC much much quicker, actually half the time compared to a hydraulic system. And incorporates additional functions like a wade program.

Why Brake-By-Wire Is Coming To Your Car

The future of braking technology is making its way from the racetrack to luxury cars to ordinary cars.

www.popularmechanics.com

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[Todd780]

Did LR abandon the market, or did the market abandon LR?

Now that would be an interesting topic.

 

[Blaise]

EricTyrrell:

My 'comfy little' modern rover can go anywhere in North America that I can find. Like I said, I'm still looking for these place which require 37"s and solid axles. Short of going to a dedicated off road park and trying obstacles, I can't find them. And I've been looking (pic below was taken in an ORV area... Rubicon owners were blown away that I was in there)!

After 3 threads, I still don't understand the hate. If you don't want a comfortable 4x4, why not just buy a wrangler? Why do you have to hate on the Defender? And why do we keep holding it to this insane standard which is way way way above anything that anyone would actually use one for?

 

[blackangie]

Argh. One step forward, two back ...............

The £65,000 Range Rover Sport is the least reliable new car you can buy for the second year running, says poll of UK drivers
By ROB HULL FOR THISISMONEY.CO.UK
PUBLISHED: 06:23 EST, 13 November 2019 | UPDATED: 06:37 EST, 14 November 2019

• Which?'s Car Reliability poll had the Range Rover Sport at the bottom of the list
• It scored one star rating out of five for dependability due to a host of problems
• This included onboard electronic gremlins and expensive suspension woes
• The smaller Land Rover Discover Sport also rated poorly for reliability

......According to the latest Which? Car Reliability poll, it scored an 'appalling' one star out of five for dependability for vehicles less than three years old, positioning it at the bottom of the reliability standings for a second year running. ........

......And it wasn't just a single issue that had riddled the expensive SUV.

Which? claimed there was an 'exhaustive list of problems', covering everything from the built-in sat nav, connectivity to the infotainment system, dashboard displays going haywire and the on-board computer software having glitches...........

......More than one in ten (11 per cent) of owners had to call out a recovery service at least once in the year before the survey was completed. ........

......That's four times the average for all vehicles, described by experts at the consumer group as 'pretty shocking for such a new car'.

And the Range Rover Sport wasn't the only problem child for the British vehicle manufacturer..........

......Some 7 per cent had issues with the engine management system, which can be a serious - and pricey - fault to fix......"

Sorry how is this the new defender?

JD. Power is the best source of vehicle info, they poll drivers of vehicles 3 years old and see how many issues after a year, LR is equiv to Toyota in the UK were they have a similar (petrol/diesel) but no where near exhaustive range of 4x4s.

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[blackangie]

Probably the best comment from the "least reliable car" article:

Having worked for JLR, this does not surprise me. The bosses want them off the line as quick as possible. Many employees have said that if they slow the line down a bit, you'd get a better car off the line - more time to do your operation and not miss things. This and their poor design change systems are the biggest issue, always tweaking because the designers never learn from previous mistakes or are too ignorant thinking they know better. Need to be less of a design led company and more of an engineering led company.

Now your posting faceless comments from articles? Are you just here to troll?

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[blackangie]

If you think about it this thread highlights the market segment that Jim Ratcliffe of Ineos Grandadier is targeting as LR moves upmarket with the Luxury Defender even as they (LR) grapple with poor reliability and high warranty cost that has to be eating their bottom line alive.

Why are you here then?

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