Odyssey vs. Diehard Platinum

[goodtimes]

Both of my batteries were replaced yesterday.

The deep cycle (house) battery would drop to less than 12.4 volts within a minute or two of shutting the engine off, with no load on the battery. The starting battery would drop to just under 12.6v under the same conditions.

The shop manager at Sears said "it's a 12v battery, it has 12.4v, it's fine". FWIW, 12.4v is ~80% charge, and when you consider that you don't really want to drop them below 50%, that 80% of total charge is 60% of usable charge -- not the condition you want your house batteries in.

I didn't raise *that* big of a scene (although I really wanted to).

Later that day, I received a call, asking if I could bring the batteries back in the following evening. I did -- and they replaced them both.

They were both just under 2 years old. Not a great record . . .

 

[1speed]

Both of my batteries were replaced yesterday.

The deep cycle (house) battery would drop to less than 12.4 volts within a minute or two of shutting the engine off, with no load on the battery. The starting battery would drop to just under 12.6v under the same conditions.

The shop manager at Sears said "it's a 12v battery, it has 12.4v, it's fine". FWIW, 12.4v is ~80% charge, and when you consider that you don't really want to drop them below 50%, that 80% of total charge is 60% of usable charge -- not the condition you want your house batteries in.

I didn't raise *that* big of a scene (although I really wanted to).

Later that day, I received a call, asking if I could bring the batteries back in the following evening. I did -- and they replaced them both.

They were both just under 2 years old. Not a great record . . .

Bummer, I was leaning toward these to replace my almost 8 year old Optimas in the Dodge. I really feel like I need to replace my batteries before heading to the Expo next month but I can't decide what to buy.

 

[Rockcrawler]

Makes me want to go check the voltage on mine... I have 2 in the Dodge for the starting batteries that I got around the same time that Goodtimes got his.

 

[lostworldexpedition]

I am not sure if I should start a new thread, but here goes.

Both of my batteries were replaced yesterday.

The deep cycle (house) battery would drop to less than 12.4 volts within a minute or two of shutting the engine off, with no load on the battery. The starting battery would drop to just under 12.6v under the same conditions.

The shop manager at Sears said "it's a 12v battery, it has 12.4v, it's fine". FWIW, 12.4v is ~80% charge, and when you consider that you don't really want to drop them below 50%, that 80% of total charge is 60% of usable charge -- not the condition you want your house batteries in.

I am having similar problems with my "house" battery. In order to trouble shoot we spent the last few nights at a campground in Cancun. We plugged the Engel into an AC source, we avoided using any lights powered by the house battery to avoid loads and proceeded to fully charge the battery. It is a Sears Platinum group 31 deep cycle battery and after it is "fully" charged it drops to 12.5v within a half hour. I admit we inadvertently allowed the battery to drop to below 10v a couple of times due to poor supervision on my part (before we got a solar panel to keep it topped of).

Have I killed this battery? Anyone? I was going to write to Mario at AT to ask him for help, when I found this thread... if any of you guys have any ideas please share. We are not planning on going back to the U.S. so I may not be able to get Sears to replace the battery.

Thank you.

 

[wrcsixeight]

Hard to say if you have killed it, but anytime it is drawn down deeply, some capacity is lost, the amount of loss depends how far down, and how long it remained there and the quality of the battery to begin with.

By what method are you "fully charging" the battery? When you are charging with this charger, what is the voltage?

Flooded Batteries are happiest when they are charged at a minimum of 5% of their capacity. The solar gurus say 5 to 13% for maximum battery longevity. I am not sure about AGM's, but I think a minimum of 5% would still be accurate. A 100 watt panel is about 5 amps. A group 31 battery about 130 amp hours. So you are near or below the 5% threshhold when charging that one battery, and that is when the fridge's compressor is not running off of the solar charging battery, and you have the panel aimed directly at the sun during midday.

My point is that your panel is offsetting your useage, but never really fully charging the battery the way it would like to be charged. If your Isolator parallels the batteries when it sees charging voltages, the solar panel is then trying to charge both batteries, making the auxiliary battery even less happy.

To really see how much life is left in the battery, you can perform a load test, which by it's nature is detrimental to the battery.

They say a battery is 50% charged when it's resting voltage is 12.2 volts. This varies with the battery brand by about 0.1 volts. You could see how much the voltage drops with a known load, such as your Engel fridge. Fully charge the battery, remove the solar panel, and turn the Engel on it's highest setting so it has a continuous duty cycle,drawing either 3 or 3.5 amps per hour depending on your model. See how long it takes before the voltage dips to 11.8. Then remove the loads from the battery, and see of the voltage bounces back up to 12.2 within 20 minutes and do some math.

Professional battery load testers basically do the same thing but with a higher load. They apply a known high load to a hopefully charged battery, They program in the size of the battery and see how much the voltage drops under that load in a certain amount of time. The less drop, the healthier the battery.

There are procedures called equalization and desulphating that some claim to rejuvenates abused batteries. Equalization basically is a controlled overcharge bringing all the cells within the battery to their full charge, because over time they will start to vary. This is not recommended with AGM batteries, but I have seen procedures for doing so on LIFELINE brand AGM batteries, by the manufacturer. Desulphation is supposed to dissolve the lead sulfate that has built up on the plates back into the electrolyte, freeing up material on the plates so they can again pass electrons.

There are strong opinions on both sides of the fence as to whether this works or not.

 

[lostworldexpedition]

Thanks for that thorough and prompt reply.

I am charging the battery with a West Marine 15amp "intelligent charger" that has an AGM setting. It starts charging at high amp low voltage and then reverses that as the charge nears the end. Seems to work.

I have only had the panel a couple of weeks now and it charges only the house battery. Since we have had it we have not had much of a problem, and being on the road it is hard to do troubleshooting. I will see what I can do, but my options are fairly limited. New battery is way beyond our means at the moment and another panel even more so I guess we will have to keep on keeping on as we are.

I still havent even figured out where or how to mount the panel... but I believe it is time to start a new thread... sorry for the hijack Dave.

Thank you.

 

[SunMan]

Mild Hijack here.

Went into Sears yesterday to get a Die Hard Platinum as my stock battery in my 2006 Tundra was acting up. They said they don't make a group 27f for my Tundra yet and the the Die Hard International was what was recommended for my rig. Anyone have any experience with the Die hard International, good, bad or indifferent? It still seems like a good battery (710CCA) and saved me $50 so i'm not all that bummed.

 

[dzzz]

Mild Hijack here.

Went into Sears yesterday to get a Die Hard Platinum as my stock battery in my 2006 Tundra was acting up. They said they don't make a group 27f for my Tundra yet and the the Die Hard International was what was recommended for my rig. Anyone have any experience with the Die hard International, good, bad or indifferent? It still seems like a good battery (710CCA) and saved me $50 so i'm not all that bummed.

I doubt it's made by Odyssey. Is it AGM?
The short CCA of a regular starting battery is technically higher than odyssey, but it won't be under less than ideal conditions.
The Odyssey/Sears Platinum can go to 20% 400 times. A new O/SP battery will hold an adequate starting charge for two years if kept at room temp or below. Way different than a regular starting battery.

I believe other sears battery are "wet" batteries. Starting AGM batteries are better for us, especially for vehicles that sit some of the year.

(O/SP isn't a great house battery, not enough amp hours)

 

[SunMan]

Correct, not an AGM battery therefore prolly not an Odyssey. My rig is my DD so it won't be sitting. Use a blue top as my house battery in my FWC.

Understand we are talking apples to oranges here, just wondering if anyone has had experience with the International. Hijack off.

 

[Co-opski]

I put a DH International in my '85 m5 and it never let me down. I don't have any numbers or facts but it work for me.

 

[Outback]

The Sears "Platinum" Die Hard is an Odyssey battery. They are made for Sears by Odyssey Mine in my snocat is an AGM and has the same CCA as the same size Odyssey I had in my identical snowcat. Now the sears regular Die Hard is not an Odyssey. You have to get there 'PLATINUM" series Die Hard.

 

[Outback]

Another member found this and posted it on the bottom of page one on this thread. This about says it all!



David:

That is a very astute observation. We private label the Sears DieHard
Platinum batteries and they are rebadged Odyssey batteries.

Thanks.

Kalyan Jana

Development Support Manager - Specialty Markets

Desk: (660) 429-7505

Cell: (816) 308-1543
Fax: (660) 429-1758

www.enersys.com


-----Original Message-----
From: Niethammer, Carlene
Sent: Monday, April 28, 2008 6:42 AM
To: Jana, Kalyan
Subject: FW: Website Visitor Comments / Inquiry



-----Original Message-----
From: db@ilikecoconuts.com [mailto:db@ilikecoconuts.com]
Sent: Friday, April 25, 2008 6:57 PM
To: Niethammer, Carlene
Subject: Website Visitor Comments / Inquiry


Comments
Hello,

I recently discovered the Sears DieHard Platinum line of batteries and I
noticed they look identical to the Odyssey line. Is there a difference
between the two?

Thanks for your time.

David Baker

 

[teotwaki]

Mild Hijack here.

Went into Sears yesterday to get a Die Hard Platinum as my stock battery in my 2006 Tundra was acting up. They said they don't make a group 27f for my Tundra yet and the the Die Hard International was what was recommended for my rig. Anyone have any experience with the Die hard International, good, bad or indifferent? It still seems like a good battery (710CCA) and saved me $50 so i'm not all that bummed.

I made mine work for my 4th Gen 4Runner based on 111db's idea. (Don't raise the bridge, lower the water.....) Diehard P2 Group 65AH at 930 CCA and 135 RC

To make the battery's reversed terminal layout work I cut a copper bar to 4.5" x 0.75" x 0.25" to act as a positive bus bar. I drilled two holes in it and covered part of it with shrink tube.

I also had to buy some longer tie down rods and cut one to length. I found a heavy duty ground strap and added some shrink tubing to it also. The OEM terminal for the battery post is covered in some shrink wrap.

 

[dzzz]

I hope Kalyan is still employed.

 

[SunMan]

I made mine work for my 4th Gen 4Runner based on 111db's idea. (Don't raise the bridge, lower the water.....) :victory: Diehard P2 Group 65 at 930 CCA and 135 RC

To make the battery's reversed terminal layout work I cut a copper bar to 4.5" x 0.75" x 0.25" to act as a positive bus bar. I drilled two holes in it and covered part of it with shrink tube.
Some Fuzzy Fotos




I also had to buy some longer tie down rods and cut one to length. I found a heavy duty ground strap and added some shrink tubing to it also. The OEM terminal for the battery post is covered in some shrink wrap.

Almost went that route (using a different model battery), they said they could "make it work" and I almost went for it but the anal retentive side of me opted to go with the correct fit. I really wanted to buy the best but in the end i think i wound up with an above average wet battery. Plus I always have my house blue top as a back up.