Pintle vs Lock&Roll vs Max Coupler

[SamM]

My preference is the pintle hitch. My Schutt trailer was equipped with one from the factory and it worked just fine on the tow home from the surplus reseller. Didn't notice any noise or slop in the system. I have thousands of miles of use with pintles. In my early years, I was a truck driver (64C) in the USAR. After going through AIT in Missouri, my backing skills are pretty good. The original (very heavy) military hitch mount with surge brakes was cut off my trailer. A 48" receiver hitch was bolted and welded beneath the trailers original tube. This was done for several reasons. Strength, to lower the hitch point, to make swapping systems easier if I decide to later and as a theft deterrent. My standard hitch pin is a 5/8" Grade 8 bolt with the military safety chains bolted on at this point. I can remove it and the safety chains with a couple of wrenches. With the pintle and safety chains removed and the locking pin installed, the trailer would be hard to steal. The pintle hitch works well for me. There is really nothing to fail.

SamM

 

[silvrzuki77]

The design changes might take care of the problem that I had (see pictures I posted). I suspect that they have just moved the design flaw to occur in a different combination of binding of the hitch. However, the crappy attitude of the owners will keep me away from the products they don't stand behind. How many hitch units had to fail and be replaced by the owner before Lock N Roll redesigned the hitch?

Sorry to hear your story about them. I have had the exact opposite response from them. Even got a personal email just asking how I am enjoying it. I have done quite a few backing up in super crappy places and haven't received and damage. Ford E350 4x4 doesn't turn very well!


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[KEENO]

Greg @ Lock-N-Roll

For what it's worth... I have a 2015 Lock-N-Roll, that was customized by Greg Russell (owner), to be telescopic to 36" long on the trailer side for Sea Kayak transportation. I now have 14,000+ miles on the hitch, in just over a year of use and no issues. It has been off-road and fire roads, but nothing as extreme as a trip to the Doll House in Canyonlands. I'm very pleased with the hitch, for it's function and easy of couple/de-coupling.

I also found the personal attention & Customer Service provided by Greg Russell to be exceptional with many emails and phone conversations.

The Lock-N-Roll works perfectly in my application, but I have never tried the Max-Coupler or Pintle. Time will tell...
KEENO:smiley_drive:

 

[teotwaki]

Maybe with a large number of failed hitches Lock n Roll had to fix both their design and their lousy customer service. Maybe their military contract ran out and they need offroaders' dollars. Who knows?

I was calling on the phone and using the contact form on their web site and was getting no response. I found my last message to them:

"Where is my order??????? You have charged my card and I am sitting here with nothing to show except your charges to my bill. This coupler never should have failed in the first place. Now you have taken my money but have not followed through with a timely delivery."

Finally got an email from "Greg Russell" and it was only a cut and paste of tracking information but nothing else. He had not provided any tracking information to me before nor even told me that he had shipped.

I replied directly to his email address and in his reply email he admitted "a twisting problem that occurs after the trailer is jack-knifed."

Nowhere near "exceptional" service. I just found one of my earlier posts about my first Lock N Roll failure

I did buy a new one after the cranky guy at Lok N Roll wouldn't even discuss the issue. It was "order a new part or I'm hangin' up" without any interest in the failure of the first part. I would have shipped the bad one to him on my own dime just to find out if it was abuse and not a failure.

What made my sentiments towards them a little worse is that I ordered one from them and it did not show up on time. When I called to inquire he admitted that he had mis-spelled my street name, made one attempt to call me (misdialled) and got some strange recording. Then after two days he suddenly "remembered" how to spell the street name and shipped the part out late. A very "take-it-or-leave-it" attitude the whole time. Since I only had half of a hitch he must of felt I was a captive customer and I had to give him my money.

Did you know that the Max Coupler was invented and produced because of lack of service from Lock N Roll?

I think people made an assumption that the Max Coupler was built by AT, but this has never been the case. We have a long history with Chris from Kilby which stretches back to when he came to us as a frustrated trailer owner who couldn't get a Lock-N-Roll coupler due to production difficulties at Great Lakes Forge.

In the first three years of my trailer ownership I had two problems with Lock N Roll. In the last three years I have had ZERO problems with the Max Coupler.

 

[silvrzuki77]

You had one of the original hitch from years ago? Totally sucks that you got a bad one. I researched quite a bit because of the FEW complaints that I came across. After seeing my friend struggle to hook up his max couple at the campsite I knew I did not want that hitch. Each is there own. Sorry you had a bad case, but it seems like they have gone along way since your dealings. I would be more than happy to spend my money on their product again.


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[fifty]

I have been trying to figure out what I wanted, as can be seen in a few of my last posts. Max coupler offers two sizes and I could not find a dealer that would answer their phone, and actually now that I think about it, return their messages. If you are one of the dealers here and have a message from a 925...888...xxxx number,don't bother calling. If you don't have a message from me, I'm sorry I didn't call you I usually like to buy from forum sponsors.

Anyways, I finally called Kirby/max coupler direct and left a message. Not expecting much.
And low and behold they called me back. I think it was chris (?) who I spoke to. He was a little rough around the edges, and not exactly friendly at first. I don't know if he gets a lot of calls from competitors or what not trying to get info.
But once he realized it was just the father of a toddler with three big dogs who wanted to tow a smallish trailer behind a biggish truck he loosened way up, explained why they had two and the ratings behind each and then we talked and we decided on the smaller one.

Very nice guy after about 5 mins. We all have bad days and maybe I had him on one,but he loosened up and was very friendly and helpful!

So that is what I ordered. I got the feeling from him that if I broke the product I could call, say what and how it broke and probably get it sorted if not just replaced. Who knows if that is the reality, but just the feeling.

As to the product? Hopefully I will find out in a few days.

 

[teotwaki]

You had one of the original hitch from years ago? Totally sucks that you got a bad one. I researched quite a bit because of the FEW complaints that I came across. After seeing my friend struggle to hook up his max couple at the campsite I knew I did not want that hitch. Each is there own. Sorry you had a bad case, but it seems like they have gone along way since your dealings. I would be more than happy to spend my money on their product again.

I don't see how you came to that conclusion.

I did not get a "bad" Lock N Roll. The Lock N Roll design structurally failed in completely normal usage which the owner admitted to as a "twisting problem".

After two hitch material failures and bad customer service I switched to the Max Coupler. The Max Coupler is not a "struggle" to hook up and has not failed under the same usage applied to the Lock N Roll. The Max Coupler has far fewer parts to fail and is smaller overall.

I don't trust Lock N Roll as a company after my experience with them because when the new design fails they won't replace it. Because you have had no problems yet with Lock N Roll you have not tested the relationship with them for when it really counts. They already have your money and have moved on to the next sale.

 

[fifty]

Hold on...can everyone take a deep breath and slow their "roll" for a second? (See what I did there?)
I think what Jim is saying is, that from his experience, and knowledge gained from his experience and looking at the product and design, there is an inherit design flaw that an not be fixed by material change, or better customer service...
AND
...that the company offered him horrible customer service.

Regardless of what the max coupler can do, the lock n roll is faulty by design and the business is faulty by attitude...


The lock n roll might have worked fine for other folks, and he is not denying that it just may have, or who is using what product the hardest, just that their is a flaw in its design, this flaw has affected Jim twice and the company has been less than helpful in correcting a situation where it's flaw broke their product during advertised approved usage...


Ughi don't think any of us (accept the ATguys) have a bone in this. We are all enthusiasts who would give each other the shirts off our backs at a campground, but when the slightest misinterpretation of a post happens it's a key board hornets nest.

 

[Semi-Hex]

In the first three years of my trailer ownership I had two problems with Lock N Roll. In the last three years I have had ZERO problems with the Max Coupler.

I just had some yahoo back into my yoke side of my Max coupler and bend it. I've had it almost four years without a single issue. The good news is that I can buy just the upgraded yoke, which I hear is even better.

 

[Robert Bills]

My two cents:

I have had a Lock n' Roll coupler for years. The Max Coupler didn't come along until much later. My Lock n' Roll coupler has never failed me and I have never had occasion to contact the manufacturer for any reason after purchase. Acquaintances of mine with Lock n' Roll couplers have pulled their trailers across the Rubicon and the Dusy Ershim trail without incident. However, should my Lock n' Roll coupler become damaged or inoperable I will most likely replace it with a Max Coupler. Not because I have criticisms of the Lock n' Roll coupler or the company's level of customer service, but because I had the opportunity to wheel with Brad Kilby "back in the day," have recommended Kilby Enterprises products in the past, and will continue to do so now and in the future. I don't know anyone at Great Lakes Forge/Lock n' Roll so I have no particular loyalty to the company.

 

[silvrzuki77]

Fifty...
All I am saying was did Teotwaki get bad service and a crappy hitch?

Yes 6 years ago.......
Kind of like when I called my wife's Capri pants pirate pants and she never wore them again or forgot that comment!

Hitch was resigned and customer service has improved since then. I have called them and asked questions about switching the hitch on my M116A3 and was helped. I'm sure you haven't dealt with them since and don't blame you.

Now on to some more






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[fifty]

^^^lol on the pirate pants!!

 

[fireball]

Is the lock and roll easier to connect in less than ideal situations?

I have very little towing experience but recently got an AT trailer and the newer max coupler. It works great but isn't the easiest to reconnect when you're not on flat ground.

 

[teotwaki]

Fifty...
All I am saying was did Teotwaki get bad service and a crappy hitch?

Yes 6 years ago.......
Kind of like when I called my wife's Capri pants pirate pants and she never wore them again or forgot that comment!

Hitch was resigned and customer service has improved since then. I have called them and asked questions about switching the hitch on my M116A3 and was helped. I'm sure you haven't dealt with them since and don't blame you.

Now on to some more

Shouldn't be cruel to your wife like that. The fact that she has not forgotten your "humor" is an indicator of what she may be really thinking.....

It was not "six years ago". It was two bad experiences with the last one being in 2013. So 16 - 13 = 3 years ago.

The Lock N Roll design might have changed but not the owners of the business. As I said before, you have not yet had a serious problem with the new model so your "customer service" is of little cost to Lock N Roll. When you have a hardware failure you can let us know if the owners are new and improved when it comes to replacing bad hardware for free.

 

[silvrzuki77]

Is the lock and roll easier to connect in less than ideal situations?

I have very little towing experience but recently got an AT trailer and the newer max coupler. It works great but isn't the easiest to reconnect when you're not on flat ground.

I can only speak for the LnR as that's all I have used personally. I had a situation last year in Death Valley on trail canyon/Jail canyon where my dad came about a 1" shy of rolling his truck. I was able to unhook my trailer off camber and spin around to winch him out. I disconnect my trailer when ever we setup camp and have never had a issue reconnecting. Specially now that I am wheeling a E350 I have had a few times the road I was on died and I had to back the trailer 90 degrees unhook spin the van around and hook back up.



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