Range Rover Classic - Educate Me

[pint]

I'm thinking about buying/building a Range Rover Classic LWB for a family camping/expo/off road vehicle. I need to haul 5 total people and our stuff. I'm a Land Rover/Range Rover virgin, but have always loved their vehicles...old series trucks, Defenders, RR's, Disco's...However, all I hear are horror stories. Just for reference, I've been a Toyota guy for years. I'm used to reliable! However, I can do most of my own maintenance, and this would not be a daily driver. I just don't want it breaking down every trip! Can I buy/build a reliable RR Classic LWB for $6-$7K? I see them listed all the time for $2-$4K. My preference is the 1995 final year model in white! Thoughts?

 

[stu454]

The trick is to stay on top of maintenance.

For $6-7k you should be able to have a nice setup.

Once you get a Rover, you'll either want to set it on fire after a few months or get another one.

You may pay a premium for a '95; it just depends on your local market. Watch out for rust.

If you're patient you should be able to land a great base truck. You can check out discoweb.org . Most of us there are rude jackarses but the info is first-rate.

Also rangerovers.net which is a very thorough source of information.

 

[Michael Slade]

Once you get a Rover, you'll either want to set it on fire after a few months or get another one.

That's all you need to know. If you go into it knowing that, you'll be fine.

 

[kellymoe]

The Range Rover Classic is in my opinion the finest vehicle Land Rover ever made. Make maintenance a habit you enjoy and you'll do fine.

 

[pint]

That's all you need to know. If you go into it knowing that, you'll be fine.

That's why I'm asking. I understand the sickness. My fear is exactly as noted...once you jump in, there is no getting out! I love my Landcruiser, but I feel like it's time to try something else. And other than LC's, the Land Rover vehicles are the only ones that get my attention when I see them. My head spins 180 degrees just like it was a naked blond with DD's! My wife reacts about the same way! :Wow1:

 

[Mercedesrover]

I can't even imagine the frustration you'll feel after going from a Toyota to a Range Rover Classic. Don't bring any firearms with you. Your truck will surely come back with a few bullet holes in it. That is, if it makes it back at all.

I loved my '91 RRC....until I hated it more than anything in the world. My truck was a well-maintained (owned by Mark Letorney of RN), 70k mile truck and only 10-years old when I got it. The first year I had it, it was great. Loved the truck. The second year it completely fell to pieces. Everything failed, and failed at inopportune times in the middle of the bush somewhere. I did an 8000-mile trip with it in '03 and put almost $3000 worth of parts in it before I got home. Never again. The trucks you're looking at are at minimum 15 years old and you'll be hard-pressed to find one with under 100k on it. I promise you you'll have trouble with it. More trouble than you can possibly imagine coming from the Toyota world.

I'm infamous for my rants against Range Rovers. I'll stick by my word. I'd rather be boring going down the trail than flashy stuck on the side of it. They didn't get the reputation they have for nothing. Do yourself and your wife a favor and stick with the Cruisers. The sense of insecurity you'll have driving this truck after a few break-downs will sour you if you're not careful. And that's the worst thing that can happen if you ask me.

 

[Michael Slade]

I'm infamous for my rants against Range Rovers.

Me too...and I've had three of them.

If you can find a way to make it reliable, the LWB RRC is an awesome vehicle. If you're not up to the task don't even try. Prepare yourself by de-tangling a plate of spaghetti and unscrambling an egg. If you can do both of those, you should start working on your perpetual motion machine. After that is done you are ready to turn your attention to your RRC.

 

[Desert Dan]

If you have a Land Cruiser and are a "Toyota Guy" why change now?

 

[Expedition Will]

I'm a rarity in the Range Rover world. I've never had a lot of problems and I have driven them all hard. I've owned 5 of them and currently pound a RR Sport in the wilds of NM on the weekends. All of this is correct about Range Rover. The thing to find is a good after market mechanic who is passionate about the cars-don't buy one with the idea of running down to the dealer in mind. A good mechanic will help you and often run out back and offer a used part which works fine. The one thing the 95 has is an improved AC sytem which can make it just a bit more comfy while getting there.
As my mechanic says-"Toyotas are sure boring-they never break".
Good Luck........You know what they say once you've done it in an LWB there is no turning back

 

[KMW]

I've had my '87 RRC for about 10 years. First vehicle with a back seat I ever owned (the Baja Bug in college doesn't count, took the back seat out, same thing with my 'B-GT rally car). My truck has some 300k on it, upgraded to a 3.9 many years ago. Lost a transmission, my fault, didn't adjust a worn linkage. Front axle was replaced with a freshened up unit from a lower mileage parts truck. Rear axle and t-case are original.

My rules to live by with a Rangie:
1) Don't skimp on critical parts -- that aftermarket water pump will leak in 6 months -- but don't be afraid to upgrade when necessary
2) EVERYTHING ignition related is critical. Cap. Rotor. Wires. I think it'd be cheaper to convert to diesel over the life of a Rover V8 powered machine just to save the tune-up costs!
3) Change oil religiously. I've taken apart many Rover V8 engines (we've got the Rangie, a Disco, a TR-8, and an MGB V8, yes, I know, I have issues) They don't like to be neglected.
4) A little bit of PM goes a long way. For instance I use contact cleaner on the window switches, all my windows still go up and down. Dielectric grease, loctite, and anti-seize are your friends (in the proper places).
5) Don't let an idiot work on your truck. Better yet, learn to work on your own truck, you should care enough to do it right. I've done almost all my own maintenance. (Edited to add) You really do need a mechanic you can fully trust.
6) Learn to use an electronic multimeter.
7) You don't need an engineering degree to own/maintain a Rangie, but it helps.

Now keep in mind my truck isn't a Rubicon rig. A mild lift and other minor mods gives me a truck that can take the family on moderate trails and to the camping areas we care to visit but is still (yes still) a daily driver.

Maybe I've just been lucky, as I've seen proof of the horror stories. As much as I love my Rangie, and as many miles as it has on it, it can be frustrating...for instance the early US market trucks like mine had a horrible speedo design...I went through three of them before I upgraded to a later instrument cluster with the electronic speedo (uses the existing signal to the ECU). That is one nice thing about these trucks for the tinkerer type -- there are so many interchangeable parts across the years and some things Rover improved and others went to junk -- you can pick and choose the best parts from various years. Perhaps not the ideal path though for a "I'm used to a reliable Toyota and think Rovers look cool" guy.

 

[James86004]

I owned two. The first was an 89 that was great and took us to 290,000 miles. Very few problems before 200,000 miles, and problems with stuff just wearing out afterwards.

The second was a 93 and it had problem after problem. A lot of that is probably due to a lack of maintenance by the first owners.

I want another one.

 

[desertrover]

I've owned my '88 RRC for less than a year and put down over 16,000 miles. Many of those are offroad, the truck sees more days off pavement than on. I replaced the starter, which failed the first week I owned it. Other than that, I have replaced a differential and the battery. Both failed due to how I treated them. The old Rangie has never failed me on a trip, be it 1500 highway miles in a weekend, 40 gallons of gas worth of exploring the desert, driving to Big Bear while bypassing the paved roads, Johnson Valley trails I have no business on, etc. Maybe it's a fluke, and maybe it'll have me practicing desert survival at the least opportune moment. For now, the RR has been a rock solid rig that has gotten me where I need to go. It has towed F-150's home, pulled 3500 Duallys out of the sand, and freed a big diesel chevy from the snow. Maybe not as reliable as a TLC, but make friends with a Range Rover, treat it right, and it should take care of you.

 

[Snagger]

I have owned a soft-dash 1994 Range Rover Classic for about seven years (300Tdi with manual transmission and coil springs). It's a beautiful car and has been reliable, though there are usually things that need to be done.

Over the seven years I have had to replace the hand brake cable when the engine's earth stopped working, diverting the current from the starter motor through the hand brake and melting its teflon coating, I have replaced a leaking PAS box, the suspension bushes and a head gasket (they typically go at about 100,000 miles on Tdis). I have had to sort a few bits of corrosion in the floors, but nothing bad - the chassis and structure are all fine. The injection pump has a minor fault and the head lining needs recovering (the glue has failed and the fabric is drooping). These are all common issues, but what do you expect from a 160,000 mile vehicle of 15 years age?

None are terribly difficult or expensive to fix, and I am just finishing obtaining all the parts to fit an original aircon system before I get the body work resprayed. I'll be almost as good as new. I plan to keep it permanently, just like my 109.

My wife took it to one of the Land Rover Experience training sites recently when I bought her a one-day course. The instructors pored all over it, very exited to see a soft dash model. Her instructor was Mike Gould, editor of Land Rover World magazine and a former LR manager (for 30 years or so, I think) - he told her that the LR management referred to the soft dash Classic as the BERR - "Best Ever Range Rover" - which was introduced because of fears that the P38 may be a failure. Most RR fans will agree that the Classic is not only the most iconic RR, but the all-round best, especially the soft dash.

 

[Mercedesrover]

If you can find a way to make it reliable, the LWB RRC is an awesome vehicle.

If you have a Land Cruiser and are a "Toyota Guy" why change now?

A good mechanic will help you and often run out back and offer a used part which works fine.

As my mechanic says-"Toyotas are sure boring-they never break".

1) Don't skimp on critical parts -- that aftermarket water pump will leak in 6 months -- but don't be afraid to upgrade when necessary
2) EVERYTHING ignition related is critical. Cap. Rotor. Wires. I think it'd be cheaper to convert to diesel over the life of a Rover V8 powered machine just to save the tune-up costs!
3) Change oil religiously. I've taken apart many Rover V8 engines (we've got the Rangie, a Disco, a TR-8, and an MGB V8, yes, I know, I have issues) They don't like to be neglected.
4) A little bit of PM goes a long way. For instance I use contact cleaner on the window switches, all my windows still go up and down. Dielectric grease, loctite, and anti-seize are your friends (in the proper places).
5) Don't let an idiot work on your truck. Better yet, learn to work on your own truck, you should care enough to do it right. I've done almost all my own maintenance. (Edited to add) You really do need a mechanic you can fully trust.
6) Learn to use an electronic multimeter.
7) You don't need an engineering degree to own/maintain a Rangie, but it helps.

Maybe I've just been lucky, as I've seen proof of the horror stories. As much as I love my Rangie, and as many miles as it has on it, it can be frustrating...

Maybe not as reliable as a TLC, but make friends with a Range Rover, treat it right, and it should take care of you.

I'm seeing a pattern. A theme. Yes, Range Rovers are very capable vehicles and when they are running for you, you'll be hard-pressed to find a better off-road vehicle in its stock configuration. But they take a lot of work and patience and you still need to be prepared for breakdowns no matter how well you maintain this truck. I used to joke that they needed grease fittings on the hood hinges. Coming from a Toyota you need to be prepared for what's in store.

And my biggest warning is about the insecurity that creeps in after driving a truck that becomes increasingly unreliable.

If you're a car-guy that likes to tinker around and doesn't mind being stuck on the side or the road from time to time, great, this it the truck for you. They're easy to work on and there are lots and lots of junk ones around that people will literally give you for free, (I stopped taking them. I'm in the automotive business and people give me cars from time to time. The last RRC someone gave me I traded for a rifle. I don't take any Discos...Since scrap went down they're tough to get rid of.) so used parts are cheap if not free. There is good aftermarket support but if you need anything that is an OEM item only, you're stuck going to Roversnorth. And why is that? Land Rover completely abandoned any Range Rover support and sold all its parts stock to RN. Even if a dealer needs a part for a RRC they must call RN.

But, if what you like to do is take multi-thousand/multi-week overland trips with your truck, this isn't the truck for you. The unreliability and quirkiness of these trucks will chip away at your confidence and make these trips more about worrying about the truck than the journey you're making. That's the biggest thing you need to worry about with these trucks. Yeah, RRCs may look great and your Toyota may be boringly reliable, but when you're 300 miles out in the bush you can spend your time taking in the experience instead of worrying if you'll make it back.

 

[galen216]

I just sold a 94 RRC at MAR this past weekend. And we had a conversation along these lines. At this point I would argue that these trucks are reliable. They are so old now that every known flaw or problem is a known entity. If you know what to look for and watch over the known to fail components then it is no big deal. All the information is out there on the internet.

I loved my RRC and always wanted to own one, glad I got the chance. If I were to ever buy one again I could care less how it was maintained or the mechanical bits, those can be fixed. Here on the East Coast a clean, rust-free body is becoming a rare thing.