locrwln
Expedition Leader
All of the same reasoning and thoughts I had and why I plan on buying them. Can't wait to see what your thoughts are.
Jack
2005 Rubicon LJ
- Thread starter jscusmcvet
- Start date
All of the same reasoning and thoughts I had and why I plan on buying them. Can't wait to see what your thoughts are.
Jack
jscusmcvet
Explorer
Got a call yesterday from Will at MC. Just calling to say thank you for the order and see if I had any questions... :coffeedrink:
That kinda makes me think this is a decent company who believes in connecting with their customers. It could all just be fluff depending on the actual product, but if the product is solid AND the service is good, big plus IMO.
Reece, the only reason I described the return to center as having any impact is that in my previous 2003 build where I used Currie arms and JJ, I had clunking that came from (I believe) the body of the JJ rotating completely from one side of the LCA bracket to the other and clunking against the steel. I had eliminated all other potential causes and that is the best I could come up with since that was the only part of the suspension that could move freely enough to cause that clunk. Might be wrong, but the return to center makes sense to me for that. In reality I am just hoping for an elimination of an shimmy, and a better ride. If I have those things up front I will proceed with more MC parts on my build over time.
All that being said, I am not a mechanic or engineer, so most of what I do on the jeep is trial and error... after a bunch of reading. Hopefully the MC parts are worth it. In any case, with a veterans discount they ran me about $100-$200 less than I would have spent on Currie, Clayton or Rokmen, which are all good, proven viable products. I am intrigued in the ride potential of the MC joints and will report here. I expect them to ship NLT the end of the month and will definitely report here.
Thanks,
John
That kinda makes me think this is a decent company who believes in connecting with their customers. It could all just be fluff depending on the actual product, but if the product is solid AND the service is good, big plus IMO.
Reece, the only reason I described the return to center as having any impact is that in my previous 2003 build where I used Currie arms and JJ, I had clunking that came from (I believe) the body of the JJ rotating completely from one side of the LCA bracket to the other and clunking against the steel. I had eliminated all other potential causes and that is the best I could come up with since that was the only part of the suspension that could move freely enough to cause that clunk. Might be wrong, but the return to center makes sense to me for that. In reality I am just hoping for an elimination of an shimmy, and a better ride. If I have those things up front I will proceed with more MC parts on my build over time.
All that being said, I am not a mechanic or engineer, so most of what I do on the jeep is trial and error... after a bunch of reading. Hopefully the MC parts are worth it. In any case, with a veterans discount they ran me about $100-$200 less than I would have spent on Currie, Clayton or Rokmen, which are all good, proven viable products. I am intrigued in the ride potential of the MC joints and will report here. I expect them to ship NLT the end of the month and will definitely report here.
Thanks,
John
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Yuman Desert Rat
Expedition Leader
Military discount? That ALWYS gets my attention. Especially with a solid company like MC. I REALLY like this design. When its time to rebuild min I'm likely to just get a new set of these and sell my old ones.
jscusmcvet
Explorer
Finally installed a new CB today. Have not had one in several years, but with an upcoming organized trail run, thought I would add it. Just went with a low end cobra, small enough to mount to the driver side of the console and not interfere with anything.
As for the MC discount, I think it was about 5%. Since their arms start off less expensive than other quality arms anyway, it winds up being about $100 less for front upper and lower.
Trying to decide if I need a rear track bar bracket and a adjustable front track bar if I go up to 3.5"? Thoughts on that? Also trying to decide if it makes sense to go up or to add the BL/MML combo instead.... hmmmm...
As for the MC discount, I think it was about 5%. Since their arms start off less expensive than other quality arms anyway, it winds up being about $100 less for front upper and lower.
Trying to decide if I need a rear track bar bracket and a adjustable front track bar if I go up to 3.5"? Thoughts on that? Also trying to decide if it makes sense to go up or to add the BL/MML combo instead.... hmmmm...
Yuman Desert Rat
Expedition Leader
Yeah you should do the rear track bar bracekt (and the front, for that matter)for anything over 2" of lift, IMHO. I've never been a fan of body lifts unless it has purpose with benefit and keeping it as minimal as possible. Up front you want to be sure to keep the track bar and tie rod in line with each other to avoid bump steer and possible death wobble.
jscusmcvet
Explorer
So if I go to 4" lift, do I need a:
Adjustable front track bar
Rear track bar bracket
Rear driveshaft
Rear sway bar links?
Right now I am at 2.5 with .75 spacers in rear (jeep sits level) and I have all stock except the lift. Any input would be appreciated.
John
Adjustable front track bar
Rear track bar bracket
Rear driveshaft
Rear sway bar links?
Right now I am at 2.5 with .75 spacers in rear (jeep sits level) and I have all stock except the lift. Any input would be appreciated.
John
jscusmcvet
Explorer
Just re read this. So you think Rear track bar bracket, front adjustable and what about the sway bar links? needed or no?
Thanks,
John
jscusmcvet
Explorer
Hate to say it but rethinking and rethinking. It is so HARD to not get caught up in Upgraditis... so trying to keep reality in mind...
I am thinking at this particular moment in time that I should stay with my current lift, evaluate shimmy after I install new control arms (arriving on Monday according to UPS), and add some bumpstop to the front to keep the tires out of the fenders. I still have questions about if I need extended rear sway bar links, but will wait on that for now. When I look at the jeep my rear axle is perhaps 3/4" off center, no need to address... Front is about the same so same outcome. I am thinking with my multi use build (DD, weekend warrior, pop up puller, farm beast) that I stay where I am at least through this control arm upgrade and evaluate further from there.
I like the low stance. I like the slightly raked stance. I just need to keep the tires out of the flares. May wind up trimming fender flares (did this on my 2003) or may wind up with some MCE flares
http://modernclassicenterprises.com/
Interested if you have experiences, etc.... the time I spend in the trees with the jeep make this or would seem to make this a viable option. Should solve clearance issues as long as I solve the other suspension issues I have.... also less expensive than other flat fender options.
Then it would be a matter of taking care of the steering and axle shaft upgrades and THEN... I could, possibly, maybe... be done.
John
I am thinking at this particular moment in time that I should stay with my current lift, evaluate shimmy after I install new control arms (arriving on Monday according to UPS), and add some bumpstop to the front to keep the tires out of the fenders. I still have questions about if I need extended rear sway bar links, but will wait on that for now. When I look at the jeep my rear axle is perhaps 3/4" off center, no need to address... Front is about the same so same outcome. I am thinking with my multi use build (DD, weekend warrior, pop up puller, farm beast) that I stay where I am at least through this control arm upgrade and evaluate further from there.
I like the low stance. I like the slightly raked stance. I just need to keep the tires out of the flares. May wind up trimming fender flares (did this on my 2003) or may wind up with some MCE flares
http://modernclassicenterprises.com/
Interested if you have experiences, etc.... the time I spend in the trees with the jeep make this or would seem to make this a viable option. Should solve clearance issues as long as I solve the other suspension issues I have.... also less expensive than other flat fender options.
Then it would be a matter of taking care of the steering and axle shaft upgrades and THEN... I could, possibly, maybe... be done.
John
Yuman Desert Rat
Expedition Leader
Haha. I used to say the same thing. You're NEVER really done.
I would do the track bar brackets. You really should have your axles centered. Sway bar disconnects are nice for when you're off road. Not a necessity though.
jscusmcvet
Explorer
I will be getting the control arms, or should be, on Monday. I am going to install sometime this week, I hope, if not it will be next weekend. I am going to do that first and see where I am. Plan for that work session is to add the bilstein rear shocks, add the control arms, add 1" more bumpstop and check what it does when disco'd.
Also today I ran across a genright hood louver that I had left over from another build. A few times in the summer I have had heat soak on this jeep, so I am going to order the rest of the louver set and install.
In anticipation of that I removed the hood insulation today. I have always wondered why it is there, even asked on several forums about it and got differing answers. FWIW, the material is a paper/cardboard type of composite with what appears to be regular old fiberglass insulation sandwiched in between. Maybe 1/4 inch worth. Some have suggested it is there to smother an engine fire. After examining it, I don't think that is the case, even if that is what it was designed to do.
In any event, it is out. Won't be going back in.
Also today I ran across a genright hood louver that I had left over from another build. A few times in the summer I have had heat soak on this jeep, so I am going to order the rest of the louver set and install.
In anticipation of that I removed the hood insulation today. I have always wondered why it is there, even asked on several forums about it and got differing answers. FWIW, the material is a paper/cardboard type of composite with what appears to be regular old fiberglass insulation sandwiched in between. Maybe 1/4 inch worth. Some have suggested it is there to smother an engine fire. After examining it, I don't think that is the case, even if that is what it was designed to do.
In any event, it is out. Won't be going back in.
jscusmcvet
Explorer
Metal Cloak LCA install
Received my order from Metal Cloak today. Not bad, even though they say 3 weeks, I ordered on Jan. 15 and received today. I appreciated the fact that they included UPS shipping info and that you can access the tracking info right from your account log in on the MC website. One note, MC requires UPS to get a signature to deliver, so consider that when ordering and make sure you have a way to make that happen. I had mine delivered to work, so 1) I could get a signature and 2) Fed Ex and UPS will not go down my road for deliveries
On to the install. Today was almost 70 degrees and sunny here in central NC. Supposed to be snowy and cold for the rest of the week pretty much so I bailed a bit early on work and came home to get started on install.
The box was torn, but the arms were packaged well, with the air filled packing bubbles and lots of tape, so arms arrived unscathed despite the 27 pound shipping weight. I was impressed with the build and heft of the arms. In the past I have had Currie LCA's and the old style Teraflex CA's. These arms were bigger and heavier than those, according to my memory. Here are a few initial pics:
And here compared to the stock LCA. Also a shot of the bushings from the stocker... I think I may have found the source of my shimmy... they don't look as bad as I have seen, but they are still past it...
Here is a shot of how I used the ratchet strap to pull the axle forward a bit. I adjusted the new LCA to 16", so easy pull with the strap of only about 1/4". To make this easier I put straps on both sides, put tension on them, loosed all 4 LCA bolts, removed one side bolts, and cranked the straps to move the axle where I needed for that side. I left the bolts loose on the newly installed MC LCA, then moved to the other side. Once I got the other side off, I cranked the strap on that side and installed bolts. Then I tightened all bolts, semi hard (keep your mind out of the gutter) and removed straps. Once the straps were removed I went back and torqued down each bolt.
Strap connected to front bumper recovery points and through axle "C"
Installed
Light was fading fast and while I have the barn to work in, the lighting is not the best. I chose to hold off on the UCA install for another day. Good news on the LCA's was this was all the tools it took.
Since I did not have the time for the UCA, but I did have the rear bilsteins to add, I moved on that. I already have bilsteins on the front, so this is part of my ride improvement strategy.
Bling Bling!
Of course, I had my regular "hired help" working with me today. Joe is actually getting to be a help these days, as you see below, When putting the tires back on, I would get all 5 lugs started and he would spin them "tight" enough to lower and have Dad tighten things up. So much fun.
After we got it all buttoned back up, we went for a quick test drive. I have been in this jeep game for a while... I can say without a doubt that this simple mod of the front LCA from Metal Cloak has an amazing impact on smoothness. I am lucky enough to have to ride on dirt for almost a mile before I get to pavement. This "road" to our house is what most would consider a trail. This change made the ride smooth right out. Kind of felt like floating over the bumps. When I got to pavement things were smooth until about 51/52 and then I got a slight shimmy, much less than before, but at a higher speed. I am sure caster is off, since I extended the LCA's by 1/4 inch and have yet to do the UCA's. I am excited to get the chance to get the UCA's installed, get an alignment and see how that effects things. I am confident that I will get the correction complete.
I am not so very easily impressed and often choose a less expensive option, due to the expenses of "real life". I can say now with confidence that the MC control arms are a worthy investment. I will report further after some road miles and after getting the UCA's installed.
John
Received my order from Metal Cloak today. Not bad, even though they say 3 weeks, I ordered on Jan. 15 and received today. I appreciated the fact that they included UPS shipping info and that you can access the tracking info right from your account log in on the MC website. One note, MC requires UPS to get a signature to deliver, so consider that when ordering and make sure you have a way to make that happen. I had mine delivered to work, so 1) I could get a signature and 2) Fed Ex and UPS will not go down my road for deliveries
On to the install. Today was almost 70 degrees and sunny here in central NC. Supposed to be snowy and cold for the rest of the week pretty much so I bailed a bit early on work and came home to get started on install.
The box was torn, but the arms were packaged well, with the air filled packing bubbles and lots of tape, so arms arrived unscathed despite the 27 pound shipping weight. I was impressed with the build and heft of the arms. In the past I have had Currie LCA's and the old style Teraflex CA's. These arms were bigger and heavier than those, according to my memory. Here are a few initial pics:
And here compared to the stock LCA. Also a shot of the bushings from the stocker... I think I may have found the source of my shimmy... they don't look as bad as I have seen, but they are still past it...
Here is a shot of how I used the ratchet strap to pull the axle forward a bit. I adjusted the new LCA to 16", so easy pull with the strap of only about 1/4". To make this easier I put straps on both sides, put tension on them, loosed all 4 LCA bolts, removed one side bolts, and cranked the straps to move the axle where I needed for that side. I left the bolts loose on the newly installed MC LCA, then moved to the other side. Once I got the other side off, I cranked the strap on that side and installed bolts. Then I tightened all bolts, semi hard (keep your mind out of the gutter) and removed straps. Once the straps were removed I went back and torqued down each bolt.
Strap connected to front bumper recovery points and through axle "C"
Installed
Light was fading fast and while I have the barn to work in, the lighting is not the best. I chose to hold off on the UCA install for another day. Good news on the LCA's was this was all the tools it took.
Since I did not have the time for the UCA, but I did have the rear bilsteins to add, I moved on that. I already have bilsteins on the front, so this is part of my ride improvement strategy.
Bling Bling!
Of course, I had my regular "hired help" working with me today. Joe is actually getting to be a help these days, as you see below, When putting the tires back on, I would get all 5 lugs started and he would spin them "tight" enough to lower and have Dad tighten things up. So much fun.
After we got it all buttoned back up, we went for a quick test drive. I have been in this jeep game for a while... I can say without a doubt that this simple mod of the front LCA from Metal Cloak has an amazing impact on smoothness. I am lucky enough to have to ride on dirt for almost a mile before I get to pavement. This "road" to our house is what most would consider a trail. This change made the ride smooth right out. Kind of felt like floating over the bumps. When I got to pavement things were smooth until about 51/52 and then I got a slight shimmy, much less than before, but at a higher speed. I am sure caster is off, since I extended the LCA's by 1/4 inch and have yet to do the UCA's. I am excited to get the chance to get the UCA's installed, get an alignment and see how that effects things. I am confident that I will get the correction complete.
I am not so very easily impressed and often choose a less expensive option, due to the expenses of "real life". I can say now with confidence that the MC control arms are a worthy investment. I will report further after some road miles and after getting the UCA's installed.
John
jscusmcvet
Explorer
I am not big on endorsing products, because everyone's experience may be different, but with this very limited experience, I can say that I am impressed with the company and the product. Big impact on ride quality.
John
Yuman Desert Rat
Expedition Leader
These arms have me very interested in a set.
Is it a shimmy or a wobble you have? Other causes can be tires out of balance, Steering stabilizer and track bars out of alignment.
Is it a shimmy or a wobble you have? Other causes can be tires out of balance, Steering stabilizer and track bars out of alignment.
jscusmcvet
Explorer
Good question. It is not death wobble, but more of a shimmy. This is not a vibration, like a driveshaft issue, definitely something in the steering. , happening now at 51/52 mph before new LCA's tonight it was happening at 41-44 mph and this afternoon that changed to a less severe shimmy. I am sure the alignment is out, caster off and I will get it aligned after mounting the new UCA's. Have a feeling that should do it. The tires are balanced, although they are old Maxxis Bighorns, which I think are contributing, or rather, exposing, front steering weaknesses. Already put an new track bar and new stabilizer.
I will keep on working on it, but I am psyched about these control arms. Change in ride quality, just from the front LCA's is remarkable. Worthwhile investment.