Buying a 1998 Discovery 1 Tomorrow!!!!!!!

[don]

Jeremy - I think you are getting emotional and thinking everyone is hating on you. I'm sure you are fustrated as hell on it but you need to take a step back. Maybe re-read all your posts and objectively read what people have said. If anything people have been real cool esp. AndrewClarke and dcwhybrew. I posted on pirate4x4 about getting 35"s and thought I had some solid questions (from owning the 90 for 4 years and growing up with 4x4's) and was essentially cast as a newb. But I got some good info and it made me think.

You are 21 - you are supposed to make mistakes and get beat up. I laugh at all the stupid **** I've done especially with cars (hell at twice your age I made some expensive rookie mistakes on my axle project: http://www.d-90.com/forum/showthread.php?t=25530). Owning a LR especially a 14 year old Disco ain't cheap and easy. But most of the time the journey is worth it. You said you ride mountain bikes - think of owning a LR as a 20 mile out and back ride, where the rear derailler blows up at mile 10 and you get lost at mile 15 and don't come out of the woods until after dark and beat to crap. But the experience and learning made the journey. Probably not the most fun ride but when you are railing misty singletrack and everything is flowing you get a better appreciation of it. That's the thing with these f'n Rovers. When the sun is shinning and the truck is running right and you just got thru a tech climb there is nothing better but damn you want to put a bullet in them when there is something wrong with it.

You also say you are no mechanic but it seems more like you just don't want to try. The tools needed to fix those axles/brakes are pretty simple and if you are looking to do any off-pavement travel would be a requirement to have on your truck (including a least some recovery points and straps). And with some work you can get them cheap. I actually used a block from a tree on the frame of my 90 to hold it up so I could work on the front springs/shocks the other day. I didn't even use jackstands when replacing my rear axle. Also would you go out into the woods on the bike or camping gear without knowing how to change a flat or set up camp? You really need to have some basic knowledge if you want to go offroad/overlanding.

I would spreadsheet what you've got into the Disco so far and do an honest assessment of what you could get for it. And see what that $$$ figure is. Talk to the mechanic and tell him you've got no more money and need the bleeding to stop. It seems he's been fixing your truck like you've got unlimited funds. If you think you could make your money back and really don't think learning more about LR's mechanics is your thing then dump it and keep the Focus. But if you will be loosing a bunch of coin and truely want to experience the Landie I say keep it and enjoy it. Put some stupid price associated to it like - "I'll be 50 cents a mile happier driving this Disco than the Focus." From the pics it looks like a nice truck and if this mechanic is worth it then you'll know stuff like the axles and brakes have a long time left on them. LR are not like owning a Honda or Ford Focus - more work but more to gain IMO.

 

[JeffRRC]

Very well said, Don.

 

[rijosho]

If the calipers were all shot and the pistons were seized, how did the truck stop when you went out for a test drive in it??

I think we see:

useful information. Useful information. Useful information. Useful information.

while Jeremy sees:

blah blah blah blah

As someone else said already, no one got pissed or jumped on you until we all collectively told you multiple times to do one thing (option 1: cheap) and you did the other (option 2: pay someone else to do EVERYTHING. Expensive. $$$$$. Complain about expense).

As I said before, if you did half the amount of research you say you did before purchasing this truck or even considering to bring this thing "overlanding" you would have seen this hobby is outside of your current threshhold for a) planning ahead, b) doing the work necessary to repair while "in the bush" and c) your current budget. Definitely agree money would have been way better spent buying a few tools and fixing it as time/money allowed. Now you've forced yourself to ride your bike. GET THE CAR OUT OF THE SHOP AND DO THE REMAINING WORK ON YOUR OWN WHILE YOU STILL RIDE YOUR BIKE TO WORK.

 

[BIGdaddy]

hahaha...it's been a while since we had a "goodbye forum" post.

Glad to hear they still happen. They always make me chuckle.

I think y'all did a great job trying to coach and give advice when asked...

 

[Smksignals]

Ah yes, the first of the two most exciting days of Rover ownership!:elkgrin:

Keep this post in mind. Everything will be just fine.

 

[Abeer]

Hello I am 25 years old and bought my defender at 22.

Here are some things I am glad I knew before I bought my D90
1. Research before you buy
2. Test drive the car
3. Have it looked over
4. Save money on the side for potential repairs

Here are some things I did not know:
1. How to fix a car
2. Anything mechanical
3. How to drill

Here are some things I have learned:
1. How to change my oil
2. How to change my brake pads, distributor cap, plugs, wires, and oil cooler lines
3. How to install a new bumper, winch, lights
5. How to use a winch properly
6. Its a huge ***** to get to the silver relays on a '94 D90 with a/c.
7. If your girl is yelling at you for car buying decisions and you're not married and you know you will probably make impractical car decisions again in the future( I can't stop looking at 70's VW westys) then there is no need for an extra headache.
8. Add extra time to your morning routine in case your rover decides not to start.

Here are some things I did not learn but am happy I had the money saved on the side for:
1. LT77 blowing to pieces and replacing it with an R380 gearbox.
2. Replacing leaking suspension components with new OME springs/shocks.

Finally, here is something I am still doing:
1. Driving my defender everyday
2. Enjoying it offroad
3. Learning how to fix more things as they come along.

I know that was kind of a douchey response but I enjoyed writing it. Basically what I am trying to say is what I've seen repeated 15 times. Listen to what these guys are telling you. I know your position, I am young too and on a just out of college salary that makes owning a d90 a pretty dumb decision but there are cost effective ways to maintain ownership. It's a fun learning process. I started with zero mechanical ability and now have moved up to .005% ability and the journey to that miniscule level was stress inducing and enjoyable. I know the one thing I would regret is if I ever threw in the towel and just sold the thing....and I have considered it.

 

[AndrewClarke]

Cool post, Abeer.

 

[dcwhybrew]

...yada, yada, yada, yada....

7. If your girl is yelling at you for car buying decisions and you're not married and you know you will probably make impractical car decisions again in the future( I can't stop looking at 70's VW westys) then there is no need for an extra headache.

yada, yada, yada, yada...

So, Abeer, how did this work out? Did you get rid of the girl? LOL:sombrero:

 

[chris snell]

I laughed when I read his stress-out about the CVs. Axles were the first real repair job that I did all by myself on my truck. I was the rookie of rookies. I think it took me over a week and a half of evenings to just install heavy duty CVs, axles, DBA rotors, and diffs for front and rear I pulled out the RAVE on my laptop (using the Disco and RRC manuals as a good supplement to the Defender WSM) and went through it step by step. I had no air tools, just a ****ty Great Neck socket set and some Craftsman wrenches and an open air garage in freezing temperatures.

I had no idea what I was doing and so I was obsessive with my cleanliness and torque values. I fondly remember cleaning off the old gaskets from the flanges with a straight razor and Goof-Off, as though leaving a little bit of old gasket on there would destroy the truck. Even stupid stuff like greasing a bearing was a two-hour process as I researched the right method on D-90 Source and then went to the auto parts store for a bearing packer and grease gun.

When I started, I knew absolutely nothing about what was behind my wheels. When I finished, I could practically do it blindfolded.





Last year, after I sheared the real axle tube in half, I swapped out the entire rear axle tube and built up a fresh one in a couple of hours.

Land Rovers take full commitment. To play in this game, you either have to be rich or you have to be resourceful and willing to teach yourself to wrench. Fortunately, for all of these problems that you're having with that truck, someone has had them before. The instructions are out there. You just have to want it bad enough.

 

[BIGdaddy]

JeremyT101
Join Date:12-06-2011.
Last Activity:Today 06:55 PM

Hey there, LiL' guy...peek-a-boo. I see you. Comin' to see who's sayin', "FOR THE LOVE OF ALL THAT IS HOLY, DON'T GOOOOO!!" ?

lol!

Dude, seriously...Get off the internet, go live your life, or grow a pair, stop being a drama-queen and come re-join the conversation... :sombrero:

 

[jwlester]

Hello I am 25 years old and bought my defender at 22.



I know that was kind of a douchey response but I enjoyed writing it. Basically what I am trying to say is what I've seen repeated 15 times. Listen to what these guys are telling you. I know your position, I am young too and on a just out of college salary that makes owning a d90 a pretty dumb decision but there are cost effective ways to maintain ownership. It's a fun learning process. I started with zero mechanical ability and now have moved up to .005% ability and the journey to that miniscule level was stress inducing and enjoyable. I know the one thing I would regret is if I ever threw in the towel and just sold the thing....and I have considered it.

I think the key here is "out of college with an income". There are all kinds of stupid things you can afford to do once you get a good education and have a steady pay check coming in. I think the moral of the story here is, be as practical as a 20 year old can be, until you can afford to be impractical. Focus on getting to the point that you can "pay to play" and have the money, time, and intestinal fortitude to learn what owning a Rover is all about. Your focus probably would have carried you all the way through college and many adventures in the meantime (albeit not too far into the 'bush').

I made plenty of dumb moves before, during, and after college, but take some of the sage advice you have been given and try to avoid the siren call of impulse. You'll be in a much better position in 5-10 years. Trust me. Forget about all the decisions you have made up until this point. YOu can't go back and 'un-buy' this truck. Now is the time to make the best decision to extract yourself from this ****ty situation. My vote is to devote a month and find some help to get this thing close to right. Then sell it off for a reasonable price and except the fact that you bought a turd and lost some money. next time you will have cash in hand and take your time to find a well loved Rover that doesn't have a laundry list of issues, abuse, and neglect.

Good luck.

 

[ini88]

I laughed when I read his stress-out about the CVs. Axles were the first real repair job that I did all by myself on my truck. I was the rookie of rookies. I think it took me over a week and a half of evenings to just install heavy duty CVs, axles, DBA rotors, and diffs for front and rear I pulled out the RAVE on my laptop (using the Disco and RRC manuals as a good supplement to the Defender WSM) and went through it step by step. I had no air tools, just a ****ty Great Neck socket set and some Craftsman wrenches and an open air garage in freezing temperatures.

I had no idea what I was doing and so I was obsessive with my cleanliness and torque values. I fondly remember cleaning off the old gaskets from the flanges with a straight razor and Goof-Off, as though leaving a little bit of old gasket on there would destroy the truck. Even stupid stuff like greasing a bearing was a two-hour process as I researched the right method on D-90 Source and then went to the auto parts store for a bearing packer and grease gun.

Land Rovers take full commitment. To play in this game, you either have to be rich or you have to be resourceful and willing to teach yourself to wrench. Fortunately, for all of these problems that you're having with that truck, someone has had them before. The instructions are out there. You just have to want it bad enough.

Chris, this perfectly sums up the ownership of one of these trucks. I think most Land Rover owners are really into their trucks, and want to be able to upkeep them. I just love the fact that when I work on it more and more I get so much knowledge out of it and makes me feel so much more confident in the field when something goes wrong. I can't tell you how many times I've been in the middle of nowhere and had something big go wrong and I sit back cool as a cucumber knowing I can fix it or bend it.

 

[LtFuzz]

Don't get me [us] wrong, Jeremy, there's nothing wrong with paying for labor. There are many capable, sharp, and experienced mechanics out there able to quickly diagnose, recommend and execute a solution for your truck. And there are certain jobs even a hardened Rover enthusiast will shy away from. I had a Jaguar/BMW mechanic in Savannah, GA with 20+ years of English car experience that I trusted completely and he got quite a bit of my money for jobs I wasn't ready/didn't have the time to tackle in my driveway.

The distinction is that I knew my truck pretty well and I was able to describe exactly what I thought the problem was and what was needed to fix it. If a further diagnosis was needed, he'd provide it, and then I'd source and provide the parts. That changes a $900 parts + labor bill into a $300 labor bill.

To be precise, there's nothing wrong with paying a good wrench to fix your ******** -- BUT only if you understand that's a convenience, not an overall paradigm for the hobby. There's no substitute for getting dirty. Read my thread about how I got marooned out in southern CO with a bashed-up radiator. If I hadn't spent the hours reading and learning from the Rover community I probably would've just set the thing on fire. But -- as a novice mechanic -- I was able to work with a local mechanic, gut the front subframe, and drive 1300 miles home on a junkyard Chevy radiator. I didn't have the confidence to be the one with the angle grinder or the one to completely re-route the entire cooling system, but I knew what I was looking at, what others had done, and what kind of tolerance Land Rovers have for these kinds of repairs. It would've been an entirely different story if I had just dropped the truck off and shacked up in a motel until the guy had figured out a way to fix it.

Another example -- last week my buddy and I got a long lunch so we took my totally stock 2004 D2 up into the nearby Huachuca Mountains. I spied a delicious mudhole and decided a wet lunch was only appropriate. I thought it'd be about 1.5-2' deep... turns out it was about 4' and in the space of 20 seconds I had drowned the 4.6L with water up to the windshield wipers. The motor died instantly. Hydrolock panic mode, right?

Well, good thing I had watched -- among other examples -- the video of Justin from Lucky8LLC drowning his D2 and quickly and assuredly popping the hood, draining the airbox, cleaning the MAF, and getting on his way. A few minutes later and I'm motoring home with a beautifully mud-covered Rover and a good story.

If you're not willing to learn you're going to fail. The information is there -- seek it out, ask DUMB questions (I do ALL the time) and watch your knowledge grow exponentially. Print out the RAVE and have it bound at Kinko's. Stick it on your toilet. I've read it cover-to-cover about three times now.

 

[rjl]

This thread in a nutshell:

Original Poster (OP): "I am doing XYZ. Should I, or is this a slightly dumb thing."

Forum: "This is a slightly dumb thing."

OP: "OK. I am doing a dumber thing."

Forum: "That is a dumber thing!"

OP: "Yikes. But now I am doing a really dumb thing."

Forum: "That is a really dumb thing!"

OP: "I hate you guys! I'm leaving!"

 

[JeremyT101]

Contrary to my activity a few times on the rest of the forum, I have given this section a good break to think about and mull things over. I have reached several significant conclusions. I'm not going to respond to the above comments.

First of all I have some very very good news. Ian called in a few favours for me and my car is now CERTIFIED without any corners being cut. That means I can Finally register it and drive it on the road. Thank god. The windshield did not have to be replaced. Also, thank god. These are the things I have decided.

#1. I am Not selling the truck. I have invested too much time, energy, money into it for it to make sense to be sold. Also, I always have loved cars, I know that I will eventually want a new one, and barring gas prices going way way higher, this one is pretty much a mint starting place for my build right now. Just being rational, why would I sell it?

#2. I am going and buying a set of tools as soon as I can get someone to drive me to the store. I'm going to do the research and find out what sizes/types of ratchets and wrenches will be most useful to start off my collection.

#3. I have decided that I am going to take responsibility for the rest of the fixes for this truck. I spoke to the mechanic on the phone today. He told me that he has got the truck to where it needed to be to pass the safety, but due to knowing my financial constraints and our discussion he was leaving the rest of the fixes up to me. He said that was his whole point of getting me to come in on the weekends basically to 'test' me to see what he might push to do, and what he figured I could do myself as well as to begin the teaching process, for the electrical and suspension. That means the hoses, radiator and thermostat will be the first jobs that I take on, followed sometime closer to winter when I have the funds to upgrade the suspension. He said I don't need to do them Now, just into the summer and preferably before I go cross-Canada with it.

#4. I really want to get the respect of the guys on this forum back. I think in retrospect that I should have given myself time to digest the information I was being fed before coming here and pouring out my soul about all the bad things that happened. Call me crazy, but having the respect of some older guys for me trying to do this, and who are willing to help me is really important to me. I have always tried to act older beyond my years, and now its getting to the point where its time to either put up, or shut up.

#5. I'm getting the truck back this Saturday. I plan to roll the windows down, crank the stereo and love the **** out of the truck I bought. I figure I just have to accept its going to be like a woman. You have to have the downs to have the ups. I have had the mechanic urge my whole life, I just spent the past while adjusting the drive line and other parts on my road bike so it doesn't rub before I posted this. Now its just time to get the tools I need to fix a car and not just a bike and get to work.

I want to turn over a new leaf, and stop being the laughing stock of this forum. I make no promises I won't post more threads in the future wailing about this truck, but I can assure you it will be accompanied by pictures of me under the truck holding up a part going, ****** is this? I Am going to go overlanding and offroading with this truck and I will prove that I am capable of doing it myself. For the record, my plan was ALWAYS to buy a set of tools and learn to disassemble this rig for the ability to fix it in sticky situations. That was one positive it always had, as everyone said it was so simple to work on. Was I overwhelmed by the initial shock of the problems? Yes. Did I feel that I could take on all of these sort of 'diagnose the small problems to find all the bigger ones' Not yet. But I will. I think its been misunderstood that it was never my intention to learn all about this truck. I have had the RAVE manual since before I even bought the truck. I just needed a bit of help to get going, but now Its all me, no training wheels.

Anyways guys, that's all for me today, Ill update when I get it back for some quick pictures of my completed rig. Thanks