Hello!
I lived in a Eurovan-based RV for several years and took it all over the US and Canada. It made it through Canada and the Alaska Highway while still getting around fine through downtown LA. Unfortunately it was burnt down in storage years ago, but ever since I have been reading this forum and looking at options for a *real* expedition vehicle. There is a lot to take in, so my knowledge is severely lacking. I also attended Overland Expo a few weeks ago and it was good to be able to see various vehicles and builds in person and talk to some experienced people.
The tough part for me has been chassis selection since I live in the US. My wants are:
- Cab over chassis to save length
- No DEF/modern diesel emissions. This could mean older diesel or could mean gas
- Enough power to cruise at 65-70 on the highway and drive up long hills without feeling like I'm going to roll back
- Comfortable, quiet-ish interior with some modern conveniences (can be retrofitted)
- Seats at least 4 (2 adults and 2 kids) whether in crew cab or extended cab format
It seemed like I had to compromise on at least one of these with any typical US chassis. The 2 front runners were: new Ford F550 with 7.3L Godzilla gas engine & new gas Isuzu NPR.
F550:
- had 5-6 feet of completely wasted hood space
- gas which can be found anywhere but the mileage goes down immensely, necessitating lots of extra fuel tanks and even then...
- diesel would have plenty of power and be the most highway friendly of any chassis, but the gas version seems just adequate due to having half the torque
- best interior of any chassis in Lariat trim
- seats 4. but crew cab adds more unnecessary length. extended cab is better, but still only a foot shorter
NPR:
- cab over with nice big panoramic windshield, saves TONS of length
- an even less powerful engine that I suspect would be annoying
- commercial truck interior. not as hideous as a FLMTV but nothing like the Ford
- can only seat 4 in crew cab form, which is unnecessarily gigantic and makes the whole vehicle look awkward
Neither of these were going to work. Then I stumbled across Excap (excap.de) and their Steyr 12M18:
-cab over, panoramic windshield, saves lots of length
- 30 year old diesel. Take it anywhere without worries about fuel. Better fuel mileage than if it was gas, so not as many tanks are necessary
- engine HP is low but torque is good. Excap apparently mods these to make them a bit better with 230 HP and I think 800+ lb/ft torque. My old Eurovan RV, which would weigh half as much as this, had 200 HP and was pretty anemic, but it had 200 TQ, not 800. I have never driven a vehicle with such a large HP/TQ spread so I am not sure how it would feel.
- in stock form, the Steyr/FLMTV has the worst interior of them all, but Excap works their magic on it and after they're done I think it becomes the best interior. I hope there is a lot of sound insulation though...I bet the diesel is very loud and I would like to be able to comfortably talk with my passengers while driving on a flat highway.
-seats 4 using an extended cab without all the extra doors and space.
The only issue here is that these are made in Germany. But because the chassis is 30 years old, I believe they can be imported easily. Am I right? I have heard some people mention bringing these foreign vehicles in through Halifax first and driving them into the US. Why is this? What if for some reason I cannot do it the Halifax way due to issues with Canada...am I done?
So then the vehicle would need a box and someone to mount the box. I am mainly considering Bliss and Krug. I am just starting the process of reaching out to them, so I do not have pricing yet, but I assume Krug will be less expensive than Bliss. I have heard good things about Krug's quality and it seems like it may be equivalent to Bliss while being priced much lower? Any thoughts here? We would like as many features as a nice GXV. We do not need an onboard vacuum outlet and wine cabinet etc like an Earthroamer. We'd like internal storage (probably in a garage under the bed) for some E-bikes. Besides that, very basic. Bliss is opening a US facility, so they would be able to mount the box whether it is made in Europe and shipped or in the US. I am not sure who would mount the box if I go with Krug? I suppose we could drive the vehicle from Germany to Ukraine and THEN import it to the US. I have also heard some good things about Total Composites. I believe one of the boxes I visited at Overland Expo was theirs. This box, though, was very basic and spartan. Which is fine but not right for me at this time. I think they are a fully custom solution so maybe this is just a lower end box and they can do higher end as well.
I think there are some people on here in the US that imported an Excap, and I think there is at least one Excap with a Krug box. If anyone fitting that description is feeling altruistic, please send me a PM. I would love to see one of these in person, and maybe even ride in one as a passenger. I'll buy dinner.
I am not entirely sure on pricing and we were looking at $500k+ GXVs, but I tentatively think this is a $250-300k project. The Excap itself seems like it will be $100k (I am waiting to hear back from them, though...I emailed and no response yet). A box might be another $150-200k. It is not a huge issue if I am off in this estimation, since this is still an immense savings over a GXV or an Earthroamer.
I hit the 10k character limit on my post so I am posting the other half as a reply underneath this...
I lived in a Eurovan-based RV for several years and took it all over the US and Canada. It made it through Canada and the Alaska Highway while still getting around fine through downtown LA. Unfortunately it was burnt down in storage years ago, but ever since I have been reading this forum and looking at options for a *real* expedition vehicle. There is a lot to take in, so my knowledge is severely lacking. I also attended Overland Expo a few weeks ago and it was good to be able to see various vehicles and builds in person and talk to some experienced people.
The tough part for me has been chassis selection since I live in the US. My wants are:
- Cab over chassis to save length
- No DEF/modern diesel emissions. This could mean older diesel or could mean gas
- Enough power to cruise at 65-70 on the highway and drive up long hills without feeling like I'm going to roll back
- Comfortable, quiet-ish interior with some modern conveniences (can be retrofitted)
- Seats at least 4 (2 adults and 2 kids) whether in crew cab or extended cab format
It seemed like I had to compromise on at least one of these with any typical US chassis. The 2 front runners were: new Ford F550 with 7.3L Godzilla gas engine & new gas Isuzu NPR.
F550:
- had 5-6 feet of completely wasted hood space
- gas which can be found anywhere but the mileage goes down immensely, necessitating lots of extra fuel tanks and even then...
- diesel would have plenty of power and be the most highway friendly of any chassis, but the gas version seems just adequate due to having half the torque
- best interior of any chassis in Lariat trim
- seats 4. but crew cab adds more unnecessary length. extended cab is better, but still only a foot shorter
NPR:
- cab over with nice big panoramic windshield, saves TONS of length
- an even less powerful engine that I suspect would be annoying
- commercial truck interior. not as hideous as a FLMTV but nothing like the Ford
- can only seat 4 in crew cab form, which is unnecessarily gigantic and makes the whole vehicle look awkward
Neither of these were going to work. Then I stumbled across Excap (excap.de) and their Steyr 12M18:
-cab over, panoramic windshield, saves lots of length
- 30 year old diesel. Take it anywhere without worries about fuel. Better fuel mileage than if it was gas, so not as many tanks are necessary
- engine HP is low but torque is good. Excap apparently mods these to make them a bit better with 230 HP and I think 800+ lb/ft torque. My old Eurovan RV, which would weigh half as much as this, had 200 HP and was pretty anemic, but it had 200 TQ, not 800. I have never driven a vehicle with such a large HP/TQ spread so I am not sure how it would feel.
- in stock form, the Steyr/FLMTV has the worst interior of them all, but Excap works their magic on it and after they're done I think it becomes the best interior. I hope there is a lot of sound insulation though...I bet the diesel is very loud and I would like to be able to comfortably talk with my passengers while driving on a flat highway.
-seats 4 using an extended cab without all the extra doors and space.
The only issue here is that these are made in Germany. But because the chassis is 30 years old, I believe they can be imported easily. Am I right? I have heard some people mention bringing these foreign vehicles in through Halifax first and driving them into the US. Why is this? What if for some reason I cannot do it the Halifax way due to issues with Canada...am I done?
So then the vehicle would need a box and someone to mount the box. I am mainly considering Bliss and Krug. I am just starting the process of reaching out to them, so I do not have pricing yet, but I assume Krug will be less expensive than Bliss. I have heard good things about Krug's quality and it seems like it may be equivalent to Bliss while being priced much lower? Any thoughts here? We would like as many features as a nice GXV. We do not need an onboard vacuum outlet and wine cabinet etc like an Earthroamer. We'd like internal storage (probably in a garage under the bed) for some E-bikes. Besides that, very basic. Bliss is opening a US facility, so they would be able to mount the box whether it is made in Europe and shipped or in the US. I am not sure who would mount the box if I go with Krug? I suppose we could drive the vehicle from Germany to Ukraine and THEN import it to the US. I have also heard some good things about Total Composites. I believe one of the boxes I visited at Overland Expo was theirs. This box, though, was very basic and spartan. Which is fine but not right for me at this time. I think they are a fully custom solution so maybe this is just a lower end box and they can do higher end as well.
I think there are some people on here in the US that imported an Excap, and I think there is at least one Excap with a Krug box. If anyone fitting that description is feeling altruistic, please send me a PM. I would love to see one of these in person, and maybe even ride in one as a passenger. I'll buy dinner.
I am not entirely sure on pricing and we were looking at $500k+ GXVs, but I tentatively think this is a $250-300k project. The Excap itself seems like it will be $100k (I am waiting to hear back from them, though...I emailed and no response yet). A box might be another $150-200k. It is not a huge issue if I am off in this estimation, since this is still an immense savings over a GXV or an Earthroamer.
I hit the 10k character limit on my post so I am posting the other half as a reply underneath this...
