Increasing Power Wagon payload

[hemifoot]

changing the springs on a powerwagon eliminates the inherent advantages of the truck.it's cheaper and more practical to just use a regular 2500 then.the gvwr doesn't change just because you changed the springs.and good luck getting approved warranty work when it becomes apparent you've grossly exceeded your gvrw by carrying a camper when it's not rated for one.once again,i'm not **************** on the powerwagon.it has gvrw limitations.

 

[LimaMikeMike]

The point is not that a 3500 is a better camper platform than a PW, but that the PW is capable of handling a camper with a few mods that retain the PW's inherent advantages. Sticker aside, the PW is a softly sprung 2500, and springs can be easily changed.

How To Match and Truck and Camper - Payload, Weight, and More

Step-by-step instructions to properly match a truck and camper including calculations for camper weight, payload, center of gravity, and overall fit compatibility.

www.truckcampermagazine.com

That isn’t the point, the OP wants to put a 2000lb dry camper on a PW, add in water say 25gal at 200lbs, camping and snivel gear 500lbs, propane and batt 100lbs, Powerwagon recovery gear that we all love 200lbs, we are quickly at 3K. This is more than 1500lbs Over the GVWR of 8510.

That is even before you fuel the truck and conservatively add an other minimum 200lbs for driver, possibly with significant other 130lbs and dog/child 50lbs. So at that point you’re approaching 2K over GVWR or possibly more depending how you pack and who is joining you.

So you would advocate cruising down the road 2K heavier than the truck is rated for? Interestingly enough all this weight is over a regular 2500 GVWR, so swapping to 2500 springs is a moot point. Actually it’s almost at my 3500 GVWR.

Of course you would still like to go off road with all this weight, after all it is a PW. Don’t airdown those new E loads you put on (which are probably rated for the same weight as the D loads you took off). They might be rated for 3200lbs a tire @65 or 80 psi depending on the tire. Guess what, you air down they are no longer rated for that weight rating.

You might get away with a FWC hawk or go-fast camper, but heck you still need to bag the truck so it doesn’t stinkbug and you’ll still be overweight. As was mentioned in the article you posted it still drove like crap with a lighter FWC.

Anyways I’m done

 

[hemifoot]

we're just going in circles now.i'm tapping out as well.

 

[mightymike]

Wow! I appreciate all the comments and replies. Lots to think about, but in the end I think I would be foolish to exceed the stated capacities of the truck and I should think more along the lines of a 3500 or a 350. and a rear locker, winch, etc. No plans at all to rock crawl, I just want to be as self-reliant as possible when traveling remotely. We currently have the camper on a gas 2006 F250 (weighing it loaded/wet this week to make sure I know the whole picture) and while in theory I am within the GVWR, I need to know. I put airbags on to level the load, I would like to not have to do that with a new truck.

 

[Adventurous]

As someone with a 3500 and a 2,400 lb dry hard sided truck camper, you will need rear airbags. Without them my truck squatted under load and you could for sure feel the weight. Some Thuren Fab 2.5” Kings and Air Lift bags w/ Daystar cradles later and it feels a lot better, but you’ll still have to use caution off-road.

 

[Tex68w]

I did it on my 2018, although not with that heavy of a camper. I went with the Airlift 5000 bags and Daystar cradles. It works, it levels the load and stabilizes it. That said, there are a few drawbacks. The legality of the weight, the added transfer of sound/vibration feedback to the chassis via the bag connection, and the reduced flex/travel and even the overall ride when unloaded. The rear end felt choppier with the bags even when unloaded and with only 5lbs of air in them.

I loved my PW and for an out of the box off-road toy, it's hard to beat it, but there are some inherent drawbacks to the platform that are trade-offs due to its designed purpose. Most of us want will want some sort of shell/canopy/slide-in camper on these trucks because they are the best options for sleeping in this platform and that is in direct defiance of the payload ratings and suspension design. Should I find my way back into a HD truck in the coming years (it'll happen, it's just a matter of time lol) I will likely buy a standard 350/3500 and build from there for this very reason.

 

[garretblack]

2020 payloads are increasing if you can wait it might be worth your while. With that weight some power can do a lot for mpg and drivability. Certainly is nice not putting flashers on in the right lane to get over a mountain pass. I have a 19 F250 and the power is so nice to have. Dodge is supposed to have some new power numbers as well. I expect the payload of both to go up as well

 

[STREGA]

Don't know about the new PW's but when I bought my new 2005 PW it came with a warning in the owners manual not to install a slide in camper on the truck. I never saw that warning anywhere else until I had bought the truck and read the owners manual.

 

[Grassland]

How To Match and Truck and Camper - Payload, Weight, and More

Step-by-step instructions to properly match a truck and camper including calculations for camper weight, payload, center of gravity, and overall fit compatibility.

www.truckcampermagazine.com

That isn’t the point, the OP wants to put a 2000lb dry camper on a PW, add in water say 25gal at 200lbs, camping and snivel gear 500lbs, propane and batt 100lbs, Powerwagon recovery gear that we all love 200lbs, we are quickly at 3K. This is more than 1500lbs Over the GVWR of 8510.

That is even before you fuel the truck and conservatively add an other minimum 200lbs for driver, possibly with significant other 130lbs and dog/child 50lbs. So at that point you’re approaching 2K over GVWR or possibly more depending how you pack and who is joining you.

So you would advocate cruising down the road 2K heavier than the truck is rated for? Interestingly enough all this weight is over a regular 2500 GVWR, so swapping to 2500 springs is a moot point. Actually it’s almost at my 3500 GVWR.

Of course you would still like to go off road with all this weight, after all it is a PW. Don’t airdown those new E loads you put on (which are probably rated for the same weight as the D loads you took off). They might be rated for 3200lbs a tire @65 or 80 psi depending on the tire. Guess what, you air down they are no longer rated for that weight rating.

You might get away with a FWC hawk or go-fast camper, but heck you still need to bag the truck so it doesn’t stinkbug and you’ll still be overweight. As was mentioned in the article you posted it still drove like crap with a lighter FWC.

Anyways I’m done

I love this forum. I see more intelligent posts per month here than I see in 6 months in the F150 forum, and in three years in the old Ranger forum. Physics always applies. As does BEDMAS. Just because Tacos roll around with 2000 lbs of gear on their rigs doesnt mean you should roll around with 3000 lb.

 

[Dalko43]

I love this forum. I see more intelligent posts per month here than I see in 6 months in the F150 forum, and in three years in the old Ranger forum. Physics always applies. As does BEDMAS. Just because Tacos roll around with 2000 lbs of gear on their rigs doesnt mean you should roll around with 3000 lb.

I think the problem is that a lot of people who don't know any better, as well as some who should know better, advocate that a simple suspension change is adequate for going over GVWR. That simply isn't the case with most vehicles.

PW may be the exception to the norm in that its underlying platform (frame, brakes, axles) is shared with higher-GVWR variants of the Ram 2500 and 3500. but the suspension and special bits (articulink, swaybars, suspension) are part of that GVWR equation...maybe FCA designed some cushion in terms of payload. I still wouldn't go too far over GVWR even so.

 

[RoyJ]

Whenever people throw the book on GVWR, I always remind everyone of the following: unless your vehicle is BONE STOCK, you can toss every one of the ratings (GVW, GAWRs) out the window.

As soon as you change to any tire that's non-OEM, or put on the slightest suspension lift, all your OEM ratings are void. Your suspension geometry, center of gravity, wheel bearing forces, drive train forces, have all been altered.

So if you're that worried about legal repercussions, make sure you're absolutely stock. Needless to say, our hobby won't exist if that's the case. So use reason, but realize going over the magical GVW on a PW is no different than the guy under GVW, but running 37s...

 

[JaSAn]

Whenever people throw the book on GVWR, I always remind everyone of the following: unless your vehicle is BONE STOCK, you can toss every one of the ratings (GVW, GAWRs) out the window.

GVWR, GVAR, GCWR are legal figures of merit. If you are in an accident with injuries or fatalities you don't get bonus points for by adding springs, tires with higher load ratings, et. al. The court will go by the number on the door pillar. You can be found liable for doing things that reduce the trucks safety.

 

[Buliwyf]

You can't upgrade the sticker. If being legal is important, get the stock 2500/3500.

The Power Wagon has nothing that you can't add aftermarket to the other HD Dodges or Fords. Consider the ala cart route. You also can get mechanical lockers and such that way.

 

[Dalko43]

Whenever people throw the book on GVWR, I always remind everyone of the following: unless your vehicle is BONE STOCK, you can toss every one of the ratings (GVW, GAWRs) out the window.

As soon as you change to any tire that's non-OEM, or put on the slightest suspension lift, all your OEM ratings are void. Your suspension geometry, center of gravity, wheel bearing forces, drive train forces, have all been altered.

So if you're that worried about legal repercussions, make sure you're absolutely stock. Needless to say, our hobby won't exist if that's the case. So use reason, but realize going over the magical GVW on a PW is no different than the guy under GVW, but running 37s...

Actually there is a ton of difference between the two.

Assuming you get 37" tires which are rated approximately the same as the OEM ones and assuming you regear to get the RPM's back to stock configuration, you can still tow and haul the OEM ratings without risking any damage to the drivetrain. So no, OEM ratings don't become "void" simply by increasing the tire size....granted a lot of fools increase tire size without concnern for weight ratings or engine RPM's, but there is a right way to do those types of modifications.

Going over GVWR is, on the other hand, risking longterm damage to your powertrain and chassis components.

You can't upgrade the sticker. If being legal is important, get the stock 2500/3500.

The Power Wagon has nothing that you can't add aftermarket to the other HD Dodges or Fords. Consider the ala cart route. You also can get mechanical lockers and such that way.

Front locker, articulink radius arms and disconnecting swaybars are not easily, or cheaply, bought and installed on the base Ford and Ram 3/4 tons. Power Wagon is a good buy for what it offers.

 

[billiebob]

like i said,niche vehicles.it think i explained my thoughts quite clearly.don't agree?that's on you.my 2500 can carry way more than a powerwagon and still off road.

The "gimmick" comment is out of place. The rest of your comments are spot on.

The Power Wagon is the Rubicon of the truck world. Just as the Raptor is the Shelby of the truck world.

To the OPs question, the PW has an 8500# GVW. Nothing will change that, adding springs of any kind is adding weight.... and further reducing its payload capacity. As several have said, trade it for a W2500/W3500. .... or revise your camper plans to match the vehicle.