Is the Ranger the Hilux we've been wanting?

nickw

Adventurer
People keep buying Tacoma's because they work well and last for a long time. Also because Toyota designs the Tacoma first and foremost as an offroad pickup, and then adds in creature comforts to make more tame versions....GM and Ford do the exact opposite. They bias their base vehicles to onroad performance and then enact heavy modifications to the chassis (ZR2, Raptor) to make more offroad-worthy versions.

The Ranger has a more torquey engine and somewhat higher payload/towing numbers compared to the Tacoma..that's about it. The Toyota tends to incorporate basic design features that a lot of midsized owners want: dampened tail gate; manual shifting modes for the automatic, crawl control, ATRAC, shock mounts which are tucked away to the sides of the axle, better approach/departure angles, better articulation from the chassis. Any one of those features may seem insignificant on their own, but when you add them all up into one complete package, they yield a vehicle with a different design philosophy from the rest of the midsized trucks....my 2 cents anyways.




I think the main reason the Ranger sells so well overseas is because it has a more powerful diesel engine compared to the Hilux. No one thinks the Hilux platform itself is weak or under-engineered compared to the Ranger.
Bollocks.

Dampened tailgate is not an offroad feature. Everytime I hear people complain about that I LOL, is that what we've become? The tailgate is aluminum and weighs nothing, I can throw it up with one arm very easily. I always think about what old old timer in an old Powerwagon or FJ45 pickup would say about some of us.....jiminy xmas.

If offroad is what your after, and you want the holy grail FJ7X pickup like all Toyota fans (I used to be one), it's won't have any of that nanny stuff you speak of. Like you say, it's stuff a lot of midsized owners want (who never go offroad), not what makes it a better truck.

Part of the reason the Toyota has better articulation is due to it's softer suspension. A FJ7X and Gwagon both have horrible articulation, guess why.

For what it's worth (not much), the ranger has multi terrain mode, "crawl control" (Ford calls is trail control or something), manual shift mode and all that fancy stuff I don't care about. It has 4h/4l and a selectable locker.

The Ranger has a lower crawl ratio, you conveniently left that out, pretty significant, 47.X vs 36:X. It also has better sight lines, which was a determining factor for me.

Neither pickup was "designed" for offroad in the same way a Patrol, 70 series or Gwagon are. They have offroad features are both robust platforms, but designed primarily for road use. Tacoma and Ranger are much closer related than say a Tacoma is to a 70 series ute.

**Edit - sorry got a late start to this thread, looks like I was repeating much of what folks already said....
 
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nickw

Adventurer
A hilux in NA would be a bust. I think there are (3) main reasons small trucks have a big market overseas, a) fuel prices are higher which dictates smaller vehicles and b) tax structure on "commercial" sized vehicles is much different from my understanding and c) less open land and more city dwelling. None of those things effect us (as much) here, hence large trucks. If Australia, for example, didn't have to deal with that stuff they'd probably be in full size vehicles.

Many Aussies actually like the big domestic trucks and think very highly of them, particularly for overland use:

 

Todd780

OverCamper
A hilux in NA would be a bust. I think there are (3) main reasons small trucks have a big market overseas, a) fuel prices are higher which dictates smaller vehicles and b) tax structure on "commercial" sized vehicles is much different from my understanding and c) less open land and more city dwelling. None of those things effect us (as much) here, hence large trucks. If Australia, for example, didn't have to deal with that stuff they'd probably be in full size vehicles.

Many Aussies actually like the big domestic trucks and think very highly of them, particularly for overland use:

Yup. I think they pay big bucks for north american fullsize trucks that have been imported and converted to right hand drive.

I keep thinking there might be a business case for exporting full size trucks there....

These seem pricey to me!


Capture.PNG
 
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nickw

Adventurer
Yup. I think they pay big bucks for north american fullsize trucks that have been imported and converted to right hand drive.

I keep thinking there might be a business case for exporting full size trucks there....
I saw a Raptor ripping around Melbourne, spoke to the guy who said he loved it as did a lot of people over there. He also said it was something like $150k USD and massive taxes....
 

Todd780

OverCamper
Land Rover Defender Crossover? (the last one in your screenshot) LOL
I think it's just the classification you choose to post your ad in. Car, truck, van etc... I think they just group SUV's and Crossovers together and he didn't edit the title.
 

DaveInDenver

Middle Income Semi-Redneck
Yup, I edited my post with a link. There is a new 2019 Raptor there for $179,000. Not sure how that converts to USD or CDN.
As of today US$1 = AUS$1.47, so a that $179,000 truck would still be a $121,000 in the USA. But it's not a straight comparison because of the refitting. Bringing non-25 year exempt vehicle here and fitting for EPA and DOT would I assume be equally expensive.
A hilux in NA would be a bust. I think there are (3) main reasons small trucks have a big market overseas, a) fuel prices are higher which dictates smaller vehicles and b) tax structure on "commercial" sized vehicles is much different from my understanding and c) less open land and more city dwelling. None of those things effect us (as much) here, hence large trucks. If Australia, for example, didn't have to deal with that stuff they'd probably be in full size vehicles.
Aren't registration and taxes coupled to weight and emissions produced that make small vehicles quite a bit more attractive than in the U.S. as well?
 

nickw

Adventurer
As of today US$1 = AUS$1.47, so a that $179,000 truck would still be a $121,000 in the USA. But it's not a straight comparison because of the refitting. Bringing non-25 year exempt vehicle here and fitting for EPA and DOT would I assume be equally expensive.

Aren't registration and taxes coupled to weight and emissions produced that make small vehicles quite a bit more attractive than in the U.S. as well?
I believe so, most countries, outside of the US tax large vehicles huge $ / %. Not sure if that is weight based, emissions based (although they both are related) or something else.

I had a friend visit from the UK, I had a 2001 Tacoma at the time with 32's and a slight OME lift, he was blown away how big it was and couldn't wrap his head around why everybody drove around in "Lorry's", aka full size rigs, which were the size of, if not bigger than, all their commercial vehicles.

He had a 1L econobox and wanted to upgrade to a 1.3L.

Edit - yeah, there was a lot of talk on IH8mud about bringing over newer 70 Series, ended up being a massive scam (but a great read), but I think they were going to land somewhere in the $100k mark with emissions / crash certs, etc.
 
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Todd780

OverCamper
As of today US$1 = AUS$1.47, so a that $179,000 truck would still be a $121,000 in the USA. But it's not a straight comparison because of the refitting.
That's true. I noticed on the same site that I linked that they do right hand drive conversions for $33,000.00.
 

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