Victory_Overland
Explorer
So the last check of the Ineos cost in 2019 was an estimated conversion rate of $37k-$56k; last month Ineos press release said they plan to build 25k units per year starting in 2021. What's of interest is, INEOS also failed to elaborate and actually didn't even mention cost and said it is undetermined but said to be "comparable and affordable"; what does that mean? Is it expected that Ineos is hammering through the global meltdown while the rest of the planet seeks major setbacks due to economic shift and pandemic; Brexit, etc? JLR only produced 19k Defenders in its last year and I believe 1988 is the only year that around 25k Defenders were produced. So then there is the logistics of building a niche vehicle in a niche market where Ineos even admits that it's expected to target the occasional off-roader; the Ineos engineering is in Germany, chassis and body from Portugal, Aussie BMW engines and then assembled in Britain. So global stats PROVE that and Ineos admits the vast majority of Defender owners were of the industrial and agricultural realm and over the last 10.5 years have shifted from Defender style SUV's to pick-up trucks. Old Defenders were still coming off the production line in 2016 so every farmer and enthusiast on the planet should be driving the old Defender that the global markets regulated out of common sense manufacturing sense.
On that note, INEOS is a niche market and even Jim Ratcliff states that the vast majority of his sales are targeted at people who are currently driving high end performance vehicles and luxury market. Not to mention, Ineos has almost zero automotive manufacturing experience; only one new manufacturer as made the global push in the last decade with legit numbers and that has been Tesla; data shows how long that took for them to finally nail it down and they build and control 100% of their design, engineering, manufacturing of products in house in just a few feet from each other.
Rumor on the street is a D80 will be somewhere in the $30k+ USD range in 2021 and that was released to CarandDriver from JLR during the December release jargon to compete with similar sized SUV which may take over Evoque sales to some degree.
Ineos is more on the lines of DeLorean when it comes to a reality; the numbers and the markets don't jive for global distribution and "accessibility" to the overwhelming majority of us "commoners". Safety and green regulation work hand in hand when being successful as a global vehicle and Ineos will never make it in the US on mass numbers off today's regulations; they do not stand a chance for tomorrow. I don't mean DeLorean on the sense of failure, but on the sense of accessibility and reality of this vehicle being a game changer in the global market like some think JLR got so wrong. Sure, they will sell, and they will not be at the price or the quality, or timeframe for the first years just due to the self-imposed econonomica, global trade, and logistical constraints Ineos created for themselves.
I'm pretty sure JLR saw that on the wall when they stopped building a Defender that the world regulatory authorities didn't want, hasn't allowed (NAS Defenders) and wouldn't allow. The old Defender would have needed a complete redesign to meet current and future safety, and green rules to remain relevant and legally/globally distributable for the next five years, ten years, etc.
Oh wait; it did get that redesign to allow that growth!
Again, we can't even get a 2020 Toyota LC into the United States to meet green and safety rules; the vehicle I would definitely be buying if it were available here. JLR and Toyota both wrote off the US market in this fashion with a vehicle that meets the specs many of you want because it can't be done with an effective approach that is sustainable; the last stand is the Aussie market and even there seems it looks only short term as regulations continues its death squeeze.
So the big OEM's couldn't make it happen but we should believe Ineos has seemed to nail it with a vehicle that has "0" vehicles coming off the production line during the most globally complicated economic and trade times we've seen to date?
Buy an Arkonik now; a 25 year old luxury rebuild of the exact vehicle you want cuz you'll be long aged or dead by the time you're behind the wheel of an Ineos in the US.
On that note, INEOS is a niche market and even Jim Ratcliff states that the vast majority of his sales are targeted at people who are currently driving high end performance vehicles and luxury market. Not to mention, Ineos has almost zero automotive manufacturing experience; only one new manufacturer as made the global push in the last decade with legit numbers and that has been Tesla; data shows how long that took for them to finally nail it down and they build and control 100% of their design, engineering, manufacturing of products in house in just a few feet from each other.
Rumor on the street is a D80 will be somewhere in the $30k+ USD range in 2021 and that was released to CarandDriver from JLR during the December release jargon to compete with similar sized SUV which may take over Evoque sales to some degree.
Ineos is more on the lines of DeLorean when it comes to a reality; the numbers and the markets don't jive for global distribution and "accessibility" to the overwhelming majority of us "commoners". Safety and green regulation work hand in hand when being successful as a global vehicle and Ineos will never make it in the US on mass numbers off today's regulations; they do not stand a chance for tomorrow. I don't mean DeLorean on the sense of failure, but on the sense of accessibility and reality of this vehicle being a game changer in the global market like some think JLR got so wrong. Sure, they will sell, and they will not be at the price or the quality, or timeframe for the first years just due to the self-imposed econonomica, global trade, and logistical constraints Ineos created for themselves.
I'm pretty sure JLR saw that on the wall when they stopped building a Defender that the world regulatory authorities didn't want, hasn't allowed (NAS Defenders) and wouldn't allow. The old Defender would have needed a complete redesign to meet current and future safety, and green rules to remain relevant and legally/globally distributable for the next five years, ten years, etc.
Oh wait; it did get that redesign to allow that growth!
Again, we can't even get a 2020 Toyota LC into the United States to meet green and safety rules; the vehicle I would definitely be buying if it were available here. JLR and Toyota both wrote off the US market in this fashion with a vehicle that meets the specs many of you want because it can't be done with an effective approach that is sustainable; the last stand is the Aussie market and even there seems it looks only short term as regulations continues its death squeeze.
So the big OEM's couldn't make it happen but we should believe Ineos has seemed to nail it with a vehicle that has "0" vehicles coming off the production line during the most globally complicated economic and trade times we've seen to date?
Buy an Arkonik now; a 25 year old luxury rebuild of the exact vehicle you want cuz you'll be long aged or dead by the time you're behind the wheel of an Ineos in the US.
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