The LR4 — Crossing America Offroad with Tom Collins at the helm!

EricTyrrell

Expo God
Oregon is going to be very interesting. This state is covered in dense forest and huge networks of old trails, most of them very rough. Forest fires are raging throughout the state. Large areas are closed or covered in smoke and temperatures are 90-100 degrees. Smoke was so bad in the city here the AQI was over 400 and we couldn't see down the street.
 
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bobDog

Expedition Leader
Oregon is going to be very interesting. This state is covered in dense forest and huge networks of old trails, most of them very rough. The other factor is the current forest fires raging throughout the state. Large areas are closed or covered in smoke and temperature are 90-100 degrees. Smoke was so bad in the city here the AQI was over 400 and we couldn't see down the street.
Yep...Since they have to go to North Bend aka Coos Bay they have to cross both the Cascades and the Coast Range. Both can be tricky even w/o fires and high temps. Lots of dirt available and plenty of opportunity to get lost.
 

EricTyrrell

Expo God
Not a cloud, just smoke of doom.
bilde


A nice cloudless sunny day on the trail..
bilde


Welcome to Oregon, Land Rover..
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PJPR01

Adventurer
Their new "stripper" version of the LR4 sold in ZA and AU has 18s. Thankfully.
And that was precisely the comment I made earlier...an 18 inch wheel in a 60 series ( Cooper Zeon LTZ, Nitto Terra Grappler or other brands is just fine for this application). How many low profile tires have failed so far? And even in the non HD package, having 18 inch tires is perfectly fine...there are some areas where having the HD package would help, but I have yet to see any RRS or LR3 w/o HD not navigate any section of the trails run so far on the signature trails...
 
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Scott Brady

Founder
How many low profile tires have failed so far? And even in the non HD package, having 18 inch tires is perfectly fine...there are some areas where having the HD package would help, but I have yet to see any RRS or LR3 w/o HD not navigate any section of the trails run so far on the signature trails...

By our reports from the trip, at least 10 flats.

The HD package should come with 18s or 17s. Not having an HD package was not the issue on this trip, the 19" wheels and 55 ratio tires was the issue. Even a 60 series tire is questionable.

I am simply of the opinion that an HD package should address all of the basic dirt requirements, including skid plates, center and rear locker, 18" wheel, full size spare, front and rear recovery points. Their HD package is really close - just needs the 18s.
 

LR Max

Local Oaf
I wish they had 17s, but even an 18" would be a huge improvement.

Yeah, 18s are available pretty much everywhere now. What is funny - try to find a 15" tire at the local Discount Tire now :)

Hilarious you mention this. My DD requires 15" and they gotta order em. Glad I don't need them today!
 

PJPR01

Adventurer
By our reports from the trip, at least 10 flats.

The HD package should come with 18s or 17s. Not having an HD package was not the issue on this trip, the 19" wheels and 55 ratio tires was the issue. Even a 60 series tire is questionable.

I am simply of the opinion that an HD package should address all of the basic dirt requirements, including skid plates, center and rear locker, 18" wheel, full size spare, front and rear recovery points. Their HD package is really close - just needs the 18s.
Agreed! :)
 

brushogger

Explorer
Welcome to Oregon, Land Rover..
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[/QUOTE]

Wow! That looks like a fricking solar flare! We went a lot of places in our D2 with the stock 18's, but I never aired down. That wheel just had too much pinch potential. Switching to the 16's helped so much. I can't imagine dealing with lo pro 20's.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Viggen

Just here...
This is the first I have seen of a CV failure. I am sure there is far more to the story.

Probably the extra thousand pounds worth of "essentials" piled inside it.

Which is usually when most IFS systems have trouble. All it takes is one wheel losing traction momentarily under power and then regaining it. . . Snap! from the shock-loading, especially with taller, heavier tires. In extended height mode the LR3/4 is near the top of the CV range so there isn't much leeway.

Whoa, lets not just leave that to IFS systems. You can snap anything doing that. People break D60 components through driving like that.

Here's my votes:
Jeep: Wrangler, rubicoon obviously, but would like to see the Grand Cherokee in that spot, as the wrangler isn't really "full sized".
Dodge: I don't see anything I'd think worthy of putting in. Powerwagon is a pickup.
Ford: Raptor would be good, but its not an SUV. You can get a choice of Expedition, or Expedition EL, as everything else isn't full sized.
GM: You get the.. Tahoe? or Suburban? or Acadia.
Toyota: You can get the Lexus GX', sequoia, or any other large variant, non pickup
Mitsu: No contender in the full sized market.
Mercedes G Wagen, or GL . G wagen may give the rubicon a run for its money.
Vw/porsche: Toureg/Cayanne
Audi: Q7.

- Jeep takes their Grand Cherokee off road. Scott covers the Jeep stuff all the time. It just takes a quick look to find it.
- The Raptor is a desert truck, not a trail truck and they do show the Raptor in places like Baja and the Southwest. If Ford ever brings back a nameplate with off road pretensions, like a Bronco, you better believe it will be out there for marketing. Right now, they are just enjoying the success of their entire market line being the most successful US product line today.
- Dodge really does not market much in the way of trucks, with the exception of the Ram towing things. Why? Thats why most people buy trucks and what they want to see. A dirt road journey does not mean anything to them. Farmers tow things down roads this trip has been on for 75% of the time.
- GM is all about trucks and presence in pop culture. They have not been about anything off road in a very long time.
- Toyota is about gas mileage. They have the Trail Teams thing but gas mileage and selling cars is what they are all about. They towed the Space Shuttle because thats what most American truck buyers are interested in. We dream of towing big things. Not dirt roading. Toyota has put almost no effort into anything else.
- Mitsubishi is barely a blip in the US market. Period. Plus, they are about rally heritage and the Evo. Thats where they make their mark.
- G Wagon a Rubicon a run for its money? Hardly. I am not a Jeep guy but articulation (something the G does not have) gives the Jeep a huge advantage.
- VW and Porsche do things all the time but they usually are in places where its expected. They did the Trans Siberian rally, set a world record by towing a 747, Dakar and Baja, Melbourne to St. Petersburg for a world record, Pan American Highway, just to name a few. VW backs trips like this LR4 one all the time. VW in Russia even sponsored a group of heavily modified Amaroks in their drive across Siberia. I would rather a Touareg over an LR4...
- Audi is about rally and quattro. The Q7 is their family hauler
 
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madmax718

Explorer
- G Wagon a Rubicon a run for its money? Hardly. I am not a Jeep guy but articulation (something the G does not have) gives the Jeep a huge advantage.
- VW and Porsche do things all the time but they usually are in places where its expected. They did the Trans Siberian rally, set a world record by towing a 747, Dakar and Baja, Melbourne to St. Petersburg for a world record, Pan American Highway, just to name a few. VW backs trips like this LR4 one all the time. VW in Russia even sponsored a group of heavily modified Amaroks in their drive across Siberia. I would rather a Touareg over an LR4...
- Audi is about rally and quattro. The Q7 is their family hauler

This is all fine and dandy, what I was merely suggesting was that:

-You don't find any other vehicle MFG doing this currently with a stock production vehicle, and as far as I know, not in the U.S. These LR4's have a winch. Their even running all season tires, as equipped from the factory. Their extras include: a spare tire or two. No pieces have been altered or removed. No "custom" skid plates. Everything is factory. You can go and buy this vehicle today, totally street legal. And there's no chase truck, repair team, etc.


- I gave a list of vehicles that a MFG could showcase as their example. And while yes, I see the GC covered in articles, and have read them, but they are actually the closest vehicle in physical size the jeep line that is in production. There is no more Commander to compete. So the largest "jeep" offering is the GC. Yes, if there was a defender in the U.S., you could then compare the wrangler with defender. Unless you want to lump the Dodge and the Jeep together.. in which case.. the Dodge Durango.

-Dodge has the powerwagon, which it DOES advertise for its off road ability. Factory winches, and lockers, sway bar disconnect. This is not the model for the farmer hauling a load. Its designed for off roading. Do you think the majority of land rover owners off road their vehicles? Even though land rovers are capable, their purchasers dont go buy them to generally take them off the beaten path. Maybe a snow covered road, to the ski lodge. A little bit of mud to go horse back riding. They are not taking it across vast places expedition style. Old H2 owners were more likely to have purchased spinners than mud terrain tires.

All of these vehicles are now more geared to a perceived lifestyle, than an actual lifestyle. Leather interiors? Leather dash boards? Real wood grain trim?


Toyota gas mileage isn't that great by todays standards. Their I force engine is a little behind the times, the big 3 are crushing them in terms of "mpg". The "lexus landcruiser" is a superb gas guzzler.

Why does the Rubicon have better articulation? a sway bar disconnect! the G is also solid axles front and rear, and with 3 lockers, 2 speed transfer case. I think its a good competitor. Perhaps not as good off road as the Rubicon, but for everything else.. its hard to beat!

the VW and porches are never STOCK in any of those event. THose are true "factory" backed events. There's a damn support truck behind them at the trans siberian rally. They had professional mechanics tearing down the trucks and rebuilding them. Perhaps you've also heard rumors that certain "stages" were cancelled because the porsches could never make it through. That is the rumor anyways. Plus the vehicles used were special built from the factory. 26 of them equipped with mud terrain tires and wheel down sizing, brake downsizing, etc etc.

Some comparison to 3 off show room LR4's with all season 19" wheels and tires.
 

Viggen

Just here...
The Commander was a POS. "That car was unfit for human consumption," Marchionne (if you do not know who that is, look it up) said of the Commander. "We sold some. But I don't know why people bought them." Yes, the GC is the largest they offer but so what? Who was comparing the Defender and the Wrangler? Dodge isnt an off road brand anymore. Its a workers truck. Yes, they have the Power Wagon package but I have never, ever seen that marketed in any way at all. The Durango was never meant to be an off road anything. Its a people hauler. It was a parts bin answer to a need for a larger SUV (it had a complete Caravan lift gate for goodness sakes).

All vehicle marketing is about a perceived lifestyle. Subaru is no longer in WRC yet they offer rally inspired cars and packages. Land Rover downgraded the Camel Trophy at the end to a lifestyle event. The G4 Challenge was a lifestyle event. Automotive marketing is lifestyle driven. Why do you think things like the Modern Warfare 3 edition Wrangler existed?

You are right, Toyota does not have a gas mileage advantage when it comes to trucks. If you read carefully, you will notice that I wrote good gas mileage and selling cars. You will also notice that I said they have put no effort into much of anything else.

The JK has an advantage because of its design. A G and JKR are the traction aid very similar but if you look, you will notice that the designs are completely different. Flex is more than just sway bar disconnects. To simplify something to that component is naive.

In the Baja race and the Trans Siberian rally, they were factory prepped to compete and finish. No different than Land Rovers Special Vehicles line for things like the Camel Trophy (or the relationship that Bowler has with LR). And yes, just as Land Rover did for the CT, there was a chase system with parts following along. As for the things like the drive from Australia to St. Petersburg, there was a roll cage, sat communications, and tires. The drive from Alaska to the tip of South America, they fit tires and sat communications. All reasonable things considering the real safety concerns involved in driving through sparse, truly remote areas of the world...

I am not trying to take shots at LRUSA for doing this. Its cool that they are taking this trip. I would like to see Land Rover do some truly difficult things. They put some effort behind the new Range Rover Sport at the Nurburgring and Pikes Peak. I would love to see them do a Trans Siberian Rally. I would love to see them do an Alaska to southern tip of South America trip. Dirt roading is effort but its not the effort they are playing it up to be.

I find it ironic that everyone is talking about 18" or 19" wheels and all season road tires and the difficulties that they are having with them. Its ironic because people seem in awe of this rather than pointing out how they were a poor choice. Hell, this place complained that the people who drove through, and broke in, and got stuck in, Africa were under prepared because they lacked a winch.
 

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