What vehicles make the best Expedition platforms?

[paddlenbike]

I was wondering how Gross Vehicle Weight Rating, payload capacity and cargo volume specs of my 3rd gen 4Runner compared to something like a Toyota Land Cruiser or Chevy Tahoe. These are the ratings the vehicle manufacturer feels the chassis is capable of safely supporting, and the results were not what I expected. In order of increasing payload capacity:

----Platform-------Payload-----Cargo Volume
'15 Jeep Wrangler 4D - 990 lbs - (55.0 cuft)
'15 Nissan Xterra ----- 1058 lbs - (65.7 cuft)
4th Gen 4Runner ----- 1285 lbs - (75.1 cuft)
Lexus GX470 --------- 1329 lbs - (77.5 cuft)
'05 Range Rover ----- 1345 lbs - (62.0 cuft)
100-series Land Cr --- 1500 lbs - (90.8 cuft)
80-series Land Cr ---- 1765 lbs - (97.0 cuft)
3rd gen 4Runner ----- 1810 lbs - (80.0 cuft)

Because the payload capacity (people + gear) is a function of Gross Vehicle weight minus curb weight, what I found was today's vehicles are getting so heavy that the payload capacity is suffering. For comparison, a 2016 4Runner weighs a 1/2 ton more than a 2000 4Runner.

All specs pulled from the same source: Edmunds.com. I have never seen anyone make these comparisons and thought they were interesting.

 

[PIC4GOD]

That is pretty much a given these days with crash safety in mind. While crumble zones and thinner sheet metal make for less weight, air bags, stronger occupant compartment, side impact protection, and additional emissions equipment add more. Back in my early driving days, I drove a Honda CRX that weighed about 2000 lbs. Today's CRZ is very similar in style to the old CRX but weighs 700 lbs more. This is in a tiny two seater car which is why it isn't doing as well as the early models because of poor handling and performance.

No different for trucks and SUVs. I would say that the main limitation in most cases is the suspension and brakes. Most trucks have enough horsepower and torque for greater loads. I would be careful with towing requirements but if you add a new suspension and heavy duty brakes, believe many platforms can exceed listed GVWR.

 

[Viggen]

Love this kind of thread. The best truck is the one they own...

The only thing not thrown out there is the first generation Tundra. The extended cab is about the same size as a dual cab Taco but you get more power, a little more added width (but not too much), and more payload. Oh, and they are much cheaper than a similar miles Taco.

 

[Box Rocket]

Love this kind of thread. The best truck is the one they own...

The only thing not thrown out there is the first generation Tundra. The extended cab is about the same size as a dual cab Taco but you get more power, a little more added width (but not too much), and more payload. Oh, and they are much cheaper than a similar miles Taco.

I did mention the Tundra. I didn't specify first gen but it's the one I had in mind. Hopefully his post something soon about it, but Paul May at Equipt has a new one that is pretty awesome. First Gen extra cab, lifted, bumpers, snorkel, winch. Really a well sorted "fullsize" pickup if you can call it that. I think they're a great platform. Many of the positives of a Tacoma but with a nice reliable V8.

 

[Viggen]

I did mention the Tundra. I didn't specify first gen but it's the one I had in mind. Hopefully his post something soon about it, but Paul May at Equipt has a new one that is pretty awesome. First Gen extra cab, lifted, bumpers, snorkel, winch. Really a well sorted "fullsize" pickup if you can call it that. I think they're a great platform. Many of the positives of a Tacoma but with a nice reliable V8.

I did not see that. The first gen extended cab is my perfect truck. It is not a cramped midsize but not a 6' wide full size. The only downside is the stupid 90 degree rear seats. I have a rear facing seat that would have to go into it and that would be a tight squeeze. Then, when it is front facing, some room is picked up but the perfectly erect rear seat makes adjustments a bit difficult.

 

[Martinjmpr]

I was wondering how Gross Vehicle Weight Rating, payload capacity and cargo volume specs of my 3rd gen 4Runner compared to something like a Toyota Land Cruiser or Chevy Tahoe. These are the ratings the vehicle manufacturer feels the chassis is capable of safely supporting, and the results were not what I expected. In order of increasing payload capacity:
.

4th Gen 4Runner ----- 1285 lbs - (75.1 cuft)
.
3rd gen 4Runner ----- 1810 lbs - (80.0 cuft)
.
...
All specs pulled from the same source: Edmunds.com. I have never seen anyone make these comparisons and thought they were interesting.

.
Having owned both, I am very skeptical of the above two numbers, particularly the volume. While it's true that the 3rd gen 4runner is slightly taller inside than the 4th, it is both shorter front to back and narrower so I find it really, really difficult to believe that the 3rd gen has 5 more cubic feet of space.
.
FWIW Edmunds often gets it wrong, sometimes it's on minor things (like saying a vehicle comes standard with 16" wheels when it actually comes standard with 17's) and sometimes they're not so minor (like saying the Xterra has a "Multi-Mode Transfer Case.")

 

[Viggen]

sometimes they're not so minor (like saying the Xterra has a "Multi-Mode Transfer Case.")

Doesnt it though? It has 2wd, 4wd high and 4wd low, right?

 

[coveboy]

A first gen Sequoia may be too large, but I don't think anyone's mentioned it yet. They're great, very reliable, not too pricey, and with a few simple mods are very capable. I had a class with a guy that drove an 04 4x4 that he swapped some 100 series rear coils in, lifted the front, 285's, sliders and skids, and it was a monster on the trails. My mom has one with 170k on the clock, and we don't hesitate to pull the 18ft box trailer for deliveries with it.

Land Cruisers are never bad. I loved my 100 series, it could conquer anything I threw at it. However, when something did break...it was never something easy to fix in the field or cheap to repair. But if you could find a lower mileage 100 series, it would never be a bad choice.
What about a tahoe? A 99 with the 5.7 and 4x4, those motors were quite reliable and parts are extremely easy to find. They have a ton of aftermarket support and can be easily modified into capable rigs. The following generation tahoes are also a good contender, but I personally was a fan of the 90's box.

 

[justcuz]

My impression was he was looking more for an SUV type vehicle. Toyota offers several in different sizes.
I think the first generation Sequoia is an overlooked vehicle for this purpose, as is a GMT400 or GMT800 Tahoe.
I saw a wrecked 1997 Tahoe 4x4 in the salvage yard yesterday, obviously well cared for with 314,000 miles on it.
If not for the accident, it looked to have many more miles left in it.
Nitro Gear in another thread is building a first generation Ford Expedition.

Frankly most anyplace there is a dirt track, an Expedition/Sequoia/Tahoe will fit and follow a Jeep/FJ/Runner/Disco/Xterra, etc. if properly set up with a mild lift, tires and locker.
Many times the larger vehicle with the V8 and full size running gear can be purchased for less than a smaller vehicle with a V6 that may not be as fuel efficient as a V8 full size rig.

I've wheeled full sizes most of my life and also own a flat fender Jeep, for pure convenience and versatility I much prefer the full sized rigs.

I want to add 2 other possibilities that are not popular, but have solid platforms, the Chevy Trailblazer and the 1st generation Dodge Durango.

Finally, if I was going to own any smaller Japanese SUV 4x4 it would be an Isuzu Trooper. You have to do very little to modify them for trail use, the running gear is big and strong for the vehicle, they have lots of cargo capacity for its size and they are cheap and practically invisible. The engine oil consumption problem is fixable and the 4L30 auto trans can be replaced with an Aisan-Warner out of a Jeep. After that it is pretty bullet proof, capacious and innocuous.

 

[Viggen]

Nitro Gear in another thread is building a first generation Ford Expedition.

Where is this?

 

[justcuz]

In the full size section.
So far they have installed 4.88 gears, wheels and tires and a fridge.
On their way to Moab the tranny died. To be continued after trans repair.

 

[MrWesson]

I own a LR3 and find it best for my uses. I'd sum up reliabilty as follows. It will never leave you stranded but if you sweat the small stuff will nickle and dime you to death. Things like parking sensors, TPMS sensors, ride height sensors("sense" the trend). With a set of a tools and a diagnostic tool like the IIDtool(I use a cheap chinese knockoff with a windows laptop) will fix just about anything.

If you expect toyota swiss watch like reliablity and run to the dealer for work(or simply don't have the time to wrench on a DD) then look elsewhere.

When making the decision to buy the LR3 it was basically GX470 vs LR3. LR3 off road capablity is amazing and right up there with a Wrangler JK Rubicon(owned one). The Atrac in the GX470 is good for the light stuff but just not designed with off road as a primary purpose.

Short version after extended 2 day test drives the GX470 was Stagnant and reliable and the LR3 felt special. Im glad to put time into the LR3 because of what I get back.

Moving on.
03'+ Expeditions with the RSC 4wd system are as capable as their IFS and ground clearance(system mimics Atrac/front and rear lockup). I've owned a 2wd Eddie bauer and they are great all around vehicles with tons of space. Mine actually trumped my LR3 by 3MPG, towed close to 9,000lbs(what I bought it for), Sat 7 comfortably, drove like a car, Toyota reliable, decent power, and cheap to boot. If I was looking for a vehicle to tour, Didn't go looking for off road trouble, sleep and cross the country in i'd have to take a serious look at one.

Montero's are often overlooked and great off road. The 4wd system is world class and you can fit 33's with little to no mods. Older ones even come with a locker.

I know I knocked the GX470 before but they make a great platform for what you want. As a overland vehicle that will get beat up a bit I would just buy a V8 4runner though.

Grand Cherokees are a dime a dozen, reasonably reliable and very capable off road(had 2 WJ's) but IMO they're too just small inside for overlanding.

 

[4x4junkie]

Where is this?

http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/155805-Nitro-Budget-Expedition-Overland

 

[Viggen]

http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/155805-Nitro-Budget-Expedition-Overland

Interesting. I was kind of hoping for a full Nitro style build but still pretty cool seeing something other than the usual catalog "build" around here.

 

[DodgeFan]

Hope this is helpful.

I built this sleeping platform for my girlfriends Tacoma and while it was better then sleeping on the floor of the bed, it wasn't very practical for more than a few nights. I would not want to live in it for any more than a weekend or two at a time.
I still kinda refer to Toyotas as mini pickups. lol

Im gonna try to find the right UD 1400 and if it works out, i may try to put a set of Rockwells under it.
UD on Rockwells... omfg
Now thats an expo rig!



Hope that was helpful.

Robert