2020 Defender Spy Shots....

[Blaise]

I dont know a thing about air suspension, but negatives about them are a recurring theme

Again I want to be wrong here, but these are my initial impressions.

Might want to read the last 100 pages or so. Myself and several other people have to keep answering this.

Positives = different ride height modes, comfort
Negative = requires more PM than coils. After 15 years mine needed some O rings, that's it.

Air suspension does not affect wheel travel, that's an entirely different design characteristic.

My truck is 1000lb heavier than the Defender with less wheel travel, smaller tires and worse geometries but I can drive the challenging 4x4 roads in the US without issue (unless we're talking about the Rubicon, which is hardly a road).

I'll give you a hint: Watching a youtube video with a clickbait title about a car that is not yet out for a 3rd party test is not a good way to get data.

 

[Twistnshout]

Another vid with a by the numbers only review. The Defender stacks up pretty good against the jeep. Jeep got beat up it's lame breakover numbers, and Defender with it's no skid plating and computer assist traction. Real world will be interesting. I doubt it will stack up with it's nice ride independent suspension vs low tech but super articulation solid axle. Still it does have solid numbers.

 

[Twistnshout]

Might want to read the last 100 pages or so. Myself and several other people have to keep answering this.

Positives = different ride height modes, comfort
Negative = requires more PM than coils. After 15 years mine needed some O rings, that's it.

Air suspension does not affect wheel travel, that's an entirely different design characteristic.

My truck is 1000lb heavier than the Defender with less wheel travel, smaller tires and worse geometries but I can drive the challenging 4x4 roads in the US without issue (unless we're talking about the Rubicon, which is hardly a road).

I'll give you a hint: Watching a youtube video with a clickbait title about a car that is not yet out for a 3rd party test is not a good way to get data.

lol, you just hate ANYTHING negative said about it. My hint to you is lighten up. It's a inanimate object not your wife or girlfriend. I or anyone can say the car is fat if I want to.

 

[Blaise]

We can discuss objectively negative things about any vehicle, LR or not! I can hate as well as anyone, I just think it's important not to trash any of the capable 4x4 options on the market as more choice is always a good thing.

But saying that you think the air suspension is bad despite not knowing anything about it is just a random statement, kinda like calling my gf fat without seeing her

 

[dreadlocks]

eh, the more hate for Air Suspension vehicles the better it is for me, its already hard enough to find em and they demand a premium over spring options.. on my vehicle it was a +$2k option originally, that cost me +$4k used, plus a flight a few states away.. dont buy em, please.. tho not being a rare option on this model will be nice.

 

[Blaise]

Ha, yeah. I was telling my gf about all the hate for the defender and that was her response:

"So if everyone thinks they aren't capable does that mean we can get one for nothing like the LR3 in a few years?"

She's not wrong... maybe I should just be quiet....

 

[Pilat]

I especially like how those negative pseudo reviews quote electronic traction control as a negative. Nothing like people who think they can do better than any system and any computer power.

"Off roading" to me is a hell of a lot more than slow-as-molasses rock climbing.

 

[DieselRanger]

I dont know a thing about air suspension, but negatives about them are a recurring theme. Also when used you lose suspension travel evidently, and I have seen pics of this new car with wheels up on some very insignificant terrain. No solid axle in the rear either, I just cringe.
.

I've had corners in the air many times and never suffered for lack of traction or responsive forward motion on demand. Two wheels is enough to keep going with Land Rover's systems. In snow/ice, mud, or sand, one is enough.

Those who say you need solid axles front and rear, and lockers front, center, and rear with feet of articulation to have positive traction are correct only for ancient fully mechanical 4x4s. But it seems to me I see many stories of those broken down on the trail and drivers bragging about having to hand-cut splines or send someone out to bring back a new knuckle or tie rod or some such, fairly regularly. That may be fun and challenging to them, but that's not what I want to do with my time on the trail.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-T337A using Tapatalk

 

[GetOutThere]

I thought is was 2004. 15 years ago....

You are correct, and my apologies.

Apparently I'm getting old fast! I can't believe that was 15 years ago!

 

[Victory_Overland]

Best way to get your TC in any vehicle to work less and more perfectly is to add a real set of tires! My KM2 aired down a wonderful on my LR3. Can't say if my TC is better or worse than a D5 or a Defender but it's pretty damn awesome and I've bought the newest of off-roaders to use it and believe in it when they get the opportunity to drive Victory off-road!

I'm allllllllllllllllll about TC, electronic diffs, manual diffs, automatic trans, LED lights, and ******; 35.5" of wading on a D5???? I would love that part on my D3 cuz I get scared anytime I touch my delicate bits in the water; I'm talking about the alternator! hahahaha

 

[REDROVER]

When you done kissing and hugging each other over the new Land Rover,
just think and ask yourself is this vehicle on top of the picture worth to have a name defender?

 

[Pilat]

When you done kissing and hugging each other over the new Land Rover,
just think and ask yourself is this vehicle on top of the picture worth to have a name defender?

Apart from the side "bags" looks fine to me - especially the new 90 as shown. I'd love a new 90 in the "van" configuration.
I like how you mention kissing and hugging, while it is you who are talking about which "looks better" and you post a picture of an old one festooned with garish stickers. Maybe you're the one who needs a hug since there is something new in town that is much better, safer, faster, more capable, and more comfortable.


I wonder; is it the old "look" you're after? In that case, yes, the old one is better. But I'm willing to bet that the old one is not even close to being as capable on a variety of "stuff" as the new one will be, in addition to the old one being less safe, and way less comfortable on every type of ground covered.

I also generally dislike how the old one you picture is dressed all up with stickers, has abysmal lights that are incandescent, and is abysmal to ride in. The stickers, though, that has always been a big turnoff for me: Playing dress-up to somehow look "tougher". Like clothes with brands emblazoned in huge letters and logos. I don't think "tough" or "rugged". I think "Really? I hope they pay to have their name everywhere.

In any case, it has now boiled down to whether you like the look of a 40 year old car or a new one. Yeah, I prefer the new one. Not so much due to look, but because it will be much more capable, safer, and comfortable.

 

[REDROVER]

Haha safer ? Where in the mall parking lot? Because for sure I prefer the older defender when I am in the middle of nowhere,
Better? In what way ??
More capable? How

 

[RoyJ]

Sometimes I wonder if we're an overlanding or rock crawling forum - in terms of real overlanding performance, as in 1000s of miles traveled, often on road, with a heavy payload, where comfort matters, exactly which vehicle (old Defender included) is better than the new Defender?

I live in BC, "overlanding" to me is ********************** on 100s to 1000s of kms of twisty mountain roads to get to remote logging road, which we have 20,000 miles of. With nearly 2000 lbs of payload, low center of gravity, I can drive in comfort and drive down just about any remote logging road to get to my favorite hidden lake.

200 series - high $$$, lower payload, and very heavy (6200 lbs LX570). Wrangler - low payload, low roof load, and subpar on road handling. G-wagen - most can't afford it. Power Wagon - built tougher, but very big and heavy. Raptor - big and low payload. None of them are bad choices, but all have their faults.

 

[Pilat]

Haha safer ? Where in the mall parking lot? Because for sure I prefer the older defender when I am in the middle of nowhere,
Better? In what way ??
More capable? How

Sure, the new one is not safer than old Defenders - except in a "mall parking lot". Old cars are so much safer, have better handling both on and off road, and are safer in a crash.
Yes, I'm being sarcastic.

Are you seriously arguing with the safety aspect of my argument? Really?

As for "better", I already explained that. Better because among other things, it has LEDs that can actually be seen, and because it will be far more capable over a variety of stuff (i.e. what you drive on). It also has higher payload, is safer for both passengers and people outside the vehicle you may hit, and it will be more capable and comfortable in general. It will be better in mud, better in snow, better in rain, better on dry tarmac, better on corrugated roads, better when wading, better when driving at night, better in the cold, better in the heat, better when towing, and better when trying to not get stuck or when trying to get unstuck.

I prefer all those things to some romantic view of a past that never existed.

Edit: Added a bit to make sure I responded to you in full.