Do you feel the need to have a weapon when camping

[Fireman78]

If three armed men bust into my office and point their weapons at me, I am not going to reach for my .380 and go down in a blaze of glory. QUOTE]


Kinda hard to go down in a blaze of glory with a .380 . Might try a .45. :sombrero:

 

[Maximus Ram]

Car accidents with head injuries can happen too. Are you going to start wearing a helmet in your car? You really should!

Logic is one thing and statistics is another. The ability to make choices based on the two keeps us from feeling the need to wear body armour in the shower.

Nah, that's why they have seatbelt laws. No choice. It's the law. And helmet laws are for the Motorcyclists. No choice. It's the law.

 

[Strizzo]

i think the point that those people who carry in the wilderness are trying to make is that while you are far more likely to have a crash on your motorcycle, it has a lower chance of ending in death than if you were attacked in the wilderness.

my opinion is that i'd rather have it and not need it. you are free to do what you wish.

 

[R_Lefebvre]

You may not have been reading what some folks are posting. It has nothing to do with fear. I have not attempted to deride you and if I have done so I apologize. I do try to make people think about how simply having a gun around can benefit them. I am not afraid of the improbable, but I carry tools for the "just in case" Ie. fire extinguisher, spare tire, insurance, etc. Why guns are such a big issue, I may never know. They are simply a tool.

Yes--Quitting motorcycle racing would probably be a smart choice. My dad made that choice when my oldest brother was born. As a result, I have had the good fortune to be able to start a family and have my dad around if I needed advice. My kids know their Grandfather and love him dearly. In my opinion, you should do the things that you love, but if those things have an inordinate risk associated with them, it is selfish to continue. I want my kids to be able to have their Dad around for advice. I have only really gotten to know my dad on a personal level in the last five years. I want my grandkids to have a grandfather to spoil them. Any choice that I make that makes that outcome less likely bears careful consideration before proceeding. You can't live life in fear, but you can mitigate the chances of some extraneous activity ruining your family's lives....

No, I am reading it, but I do believe it's all based on fear despite what the posters claim. It may not be palpable fear, but it is fear at least at the subconscious level.

As for the racing... yeah... I'm unsure. I don't actually think enduro racing is that dangerous. It's relatively low speed, no jumping etc. But it's really hard to draw any conclusions since it's relatively rare so deaths are really onesy-twosy. I think it's certainly no more dangerous than a sedentary lifestyle. But I'm often close to hanging up the gloves.

 

[Klierslc]

Because, it seems to me from my research, that . The very things needed to render the gun safe and legal, also limit it's usefulness. As I said before:

"Excuse Mr. Badguy, can you please wait while I unlock and load my gun?"

But nothing actually happened to him. We're only guessing at what might have happened if the other truck hadn't shown up. We're only guessing at what might have happened had he had a gun.

Based on my research, no planes have ever crashed into my home. Does that mean it couldn't happen?

Should I live in a bunker? Where do you draw the line on defending yourself against the improbably? I'm sure you'll answer "Somewhere between carrying a gun, and living in a bunker." But the reality is, every day, you take greater chances than walking around unarmed.


It's not logical to fear the improbable!

You again choose to ignore the 2.5 million defensive uses of guns per year. Compare that to the amount of folks who have had their guns taken and then used on them. How does that translate into

"the chance of my own gun harming me or my own, is higher than the probability of me ever being assaulted"?

The rules for you northerners are your own fault, Fire the queen and get a real constitution......




Just kidding. Seriously, I might have a similar point of view if faced with similar restrictions....

You are right, my commute is probably more dangerous than camping- with or without a gun. However, look at the big picture.

There are many things in the world that can end your life. You wear a helmet to decrease the chance that you die. You wear a seatbelt, you don't travel in alleys at night, you don't smoke, you have a smoke detector, you have a dog, you drive a new car, you cook your chicken to 160 degrees, you carry a first aid kit, you carry a survival kit in the car--you do all of these things to decrease your chances of getting killed. Why not add a firearm to the list. I sense that you have been bitten by the "guns R bad" bug, but look at it objectively. It is just a tool.

You also haven't responded to the survivalist argument posited a few pages back. Good luck hunting food with your bear spray if you become disabled or lost the the wilderness.

 

[SunTzuNephew]

If three armed men bust into my office and point their weapons at me, I am not going to reach for my .380 and go down in a blaze of glory. QUOTE]


Kinda hard to go down in a blaze of glory with a .380 . Might try a .45. :sombrero:

Well, a .380 can hurt...it's not a .25, after all.:victory:

 

[R_Lefebvre]

You again choose to ignore the 2.5 million defensive uses of guns per year.

This is getting tedious. You are ignoring the 2.5 million defensive uses of guns that DON'T happen in Canada every year, yet we have a lower crime rate. Why?

The rules for you northerners are your own fault, Fire the queen and get a real constitution......




Just kidding. Seriously, I might have a similar point of view if faced with similar restrictions....

I wouldn't change those restrictions. (and many non-commonwealth countries have the same restrictions) I LIKE those restrictions. The system isn't perfect, but it's *working*.

I guess I should say what I figured out a few years ago. If I lived in the US, I would own a gun. It's easy, and everybody has one. I choose to live in Canada, because everybody doesn't have a gun, and I don't need one. I had a job in the US, and could have easily moved there (I commuted daily from Canada for 6 years). I chose not to.

There are many things in the world that can end your life. You wear a helmet to decrease the chance that you die. You wear a seatbelt, you don't travel in alleys at night, you don't smoke, you have a smoke detector, you have a dog, you drive a new car, you cook your chicken to 160 degrees, you carry a first aid kit, you carry a survival kit in the car--you do all of these things to decrease your chances of getting killed. Why not add a firearm to the list. I sense that you have been bitten by the "guns R bad" bug, but look at it objectively. It is just a tool.

Do you carry a AED? It's a tool. I think it's MUCH more likely to save a life.

We can't all carry all the tools. We all pick and choose, based on our perceptions and fears.

I used to have the "guns R bad" bug. It was largely dispelled when I went to the range. I already said, I think guns are cool. If I had the money, I'd buy lots of guns, just because they're cool. But I would lock them up. Just the same as I safety my power nailer, my welder (or at least the 220V socket for it), etc.

You also haven't responded to the survivalist argument posited a few pages back. Good luck hunting food with your bear spray if you become disabled or lost the the wilderness.

Well, I already answered it I thought. In certain rare circumstances, I'm screwed.

As for hunting... now there IS a good use. That IS why I said I would like to get a gun for TEOTWAWKI. And something in this thread made me switch that thought from shotguns for defence, to a rifle. If I were to have a gun, and it had to be unloaded, it would be faster to use because I imagine popping in a magazine is faster than plugging shells into a shotgun.

 

[Maximus Ram]

As for hunting... now there IS a good use. That IS why I said I would like to get a gun for TEOTWAWKI. And something in this thread made me switch that thought from shotguns for defence, to a rifle. If I were to have a gun, and it had to be unloaded, it would be faster to use because I imagine popping in a magazine is faster than plugging shells into a shotgun.

Rob, here's a shotgun for you. No need to feed a tube..

 

[Fireman78]

I think it's funny how topics like this go downhill. It is a good question, definatly one's own perspective... now excuse me while I grab my shotgun, my .45, and a sixpack and head down a trail in my 8000 pound truck ... :elkgrin:

 

[Mr. Leary]

I think it's funny how topics like this go downhill. It is a good question, definatly one's own perspective... now excuse me while I grab my shotgun, my .45, and a sixpack and head down a trail in my 8000 pound truck ... :elkgrin:

:coffeedrink:

Are you the person my parents warned me about? :sombrero:

 

[93BLAZER]

I think it's funny how topics like this go downhill. It is a good question, definatly one's own perspective... now excuse me while I grab my shotgun, my .45, and a sixpack and head down a trail in my 8000 pound truck ... :elkgrin:

Do you think a 6 pack is sufficient?

 

[jh504]

I think it's funny how topics like this go downhill.

Yeah, it was not a political question so why do folks feel the need to share a political opinion? Whatever.

On your topic I think you may be limiting yourself some with the 6 pack.

 

[Maximus Ram]

It's ok, it's light beer...:beer:

 

[Hilldweller]

I think it's funny how topics like this go downhill. It is a good question, definatly one's own perspective... now excuse me while I grab my shotgun, my .45, and a sixpack and head down a trail in my 8000 pound truck ... :elkgrin:

Dad? Is that you? :Wow1:

 

[AYIAPhoto]

Before I am castigated for making this a political debate, I in no way intend it to be such. But after reading through 27 pages I would like to reply. First: yes I do carry while camping(and almost any other time it is possible). Second: Choosing to carry anywhere whether camping or your daily life is a choice you need to make for yourself and one which carries certain responsibilities placed solely on you.

Kye-Good question.
My perspective: One always has a weapon of some sort available. You just need to look at everyday objects in a new light, Typical stuff one takes camping can make a pretty useful self-defense tool: Fire extinguishers, camping knives, fuel bottles, flashlights and a zillion other things can all be used as weapons.

A firearm is much more efficient though. Expecting someone of small stature or diminished physical capacity to swing a fuel bottle or fire extinguisher like a mace and hitting a target is hoping for the best. Where as my 110lb ex could empty 7 .45s into a target with ease.

If there's a bear in camp, the first line of defense is the alarm remote on my keychain. If the honking horn doesn't scare it off, we have an air horn. Then bear spray. Then the 12 gauge.

And that is the way it should be, appropriate force for the level of threat.

I pack a weimy.......70lbs of lean muscle with a large set of teeth.

A large dog is no better than a small alert dog for your defense. My sisters miniature jack russell awoke her husband when someone tried to break into her old home but would not have been able to do much protecting there or if he had been with them in the woods. I buried my 85lb English Bull Terrier 2 years ago because he did what a loyal dog should do, he put himself between my nieces and a very aggressive hungry black bear. He died some hours later from injuries. He "helped" protect my nieces but was not the one to stop the bear, that task fell to my brother in law and 2 large slugs. The melee that seemed to take several minutes was really over in seconds. The bear had incapacitated my dog in seconds. While he had chased off many bears in the past this one was determined to get by him.

You never know what you might encounter when in the back country and away from civilization, and the most dangerous creatures out there are the two legged ones.

Who usualy are unphased by car alarms and other loud noises.

Living this close to the border I worry more about people than animals.

Living less than 15 minutes from NYC(which in my younger dumber years was fun to sneak off to), Newark, and other such areas I agree whole heartedly.

Millions of people all over the world seem to survive just fine without guns, so I probably can as well.

And millions are slaughtered over old tribal grudges all over the world as well...

No one is at risk of being killed by my 20 year old pocket knife,
I also prefer the people I travel with to not carry. People crash cars, set stuff on fire, and generally make mistakes. I'd rather not be around when that mistake involves a gun.

I feel the same way about people who decide to take their 100+lb dog with them. I don't know how well they have trained or can control their dog. I have seen people with dogs they themselves were afraid of. The difference being a gun on your hip has no personality or temperament. A dog on the other hand has a mind all its own.

I have never found myself in a situation where firearms might have helped deter a threat.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,589077,00.html?test=latestnews

A proper knife and training can be very effective for personal defense, against man or animal.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,589077,00.html?test=latestnews

Could you live with yourself if you were hit by a drunk driver and your wife and kids were injured because your 91 4runner doesn't have side impact airbags?

I have no control over someone elses vehicle or their driving ability either drunk or sober. I do have control over who or what I allow to be in my personal space while outside of a vehicle.

It was an analogy, you can't add after market airbags, but you can choose to drive a vehicle with airbags.

Actually I can't chose a vehicle with airbags as a It would be out of my budget. To compound the issue, all the airbags in the world don't mean diddly if hit by something such as my daily driver "Westernstar", they simply lower the odds of death in a more common accident involving a vehicle of similar size. My firearms don't mean diddly in the common occurrences of my day to day life but DO improve my odds in the less likely situations.

That's a VERY good point. I would think the odds of somebody needing ANY weapon for defense is very much lower than the odds of one being injured driving or riding in an older vehicle.

Police(contrary to any popular belief) carry side arms not to protect the public but themselves. A police officer is exponentially more likely to be injured or killed in an auto accident than a shoot out. By your statement they would be better served by not pursuing suspects and not stopping on the side of the road to issue a summons than to carry a firearm.

How do you feel about this?
http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/cgi/content/abstract/107/6/1247

Not really a concern for me as I have no children nor do I camp with any. That goes toward the point of this being a personal choice, both as to if you will and how you would carry a firearm.

What he did say: "Woe to you, my Princess, when I come... you shall see who is the stronger, a gentle girl who doesn't eat enough or a big wild man who has cocaine in his body. "

Yeah, I don't have much respect for anything Freud said.

So you dont agree that a petite woman is an easy target for a much larger (as the quote stated)coked up man?

One of my best friends in an LEO in MI, and he's the one who introduced me to guns. When he first told me he carried everywhere he went... I was shocked. He took me to the range, and I got a little more comfortable. Most especially because of his skill...

However, if I saw somebody I didn't personally know in a campsite who was carrying, I would likely leave.

Do you walk out of the coffee shop if you see an armed officer you don't know enter? Does a badge suddenly endow the holder with jedi like powers and an unfailing temperament?